A senseless and futile gesture … and our senators are just the ones to do it

Thank you, Jim Hartman, for pointing out in today’s Elko Daily Free Press that the proposal by Nevada’s two Democratic U.S. Sens. Catherine Cortez Masto and Jacky Rosen to waive the 18.4 cent per gallon federal gasoline tax through 2022 is not only a political gesture, but for Nevadans it is a futile gesture.

Hartman is the first I’ve seen to point out that Nevada has on the books Nevada Revised Statute 365.185, which automatically increases the state gasoline tax “equal to the amount by which the federal tax is reduced,” so it won’t save Nevadans a cent.

Hartman also observes:

It’s a terrible idea. No one likes paying taxes or feeling gouged at the pump, and that’s the appeal to politicians. It’s a transparent political stunt to give political cover to a handful of Democrats up for election in states where gas prices are going up over 40 percent from last year.
Nevada’s gas prices are up $1.07 per gallon from a year ago, reaching an average price in Nevada for regular of $3.97 (Feb. 23). Crude prices recently passed $90 per barrel and the Russian invasion of Ukraine will raise crude prices to over $100.
Cortez Masto’s legislation is a contradiction in her climate politics. Isn’t the central tenet of Democratic climate plans to raise the price of fossil fuels so we use less? Progressives should welcome higher gasoline prices until consumption drops dramatically.
You can’t have an aggressive “green” climate policy and cheap gasoline. You must choose one or the other.

405 comments on “A senseless and futile gesture … and our senators are just the ones to do it

  1. Steve says:

    Also, a sneaky (back door) way to increase state revenue.

  2. The Democrats are trying to put a tourniquet on their upcoming blood bath in November. Problem is, their ignorant sheep will buy this crap.

  3. Apparently the R-J posted something online Tuesday evening pointing out the futility of the federal gasoline tax suspension for Nevadans, but I’m told there was no room in the printed paper due to breaking news and it is sked for Sunday Nevada section. https://www.reviewjournal.com/news/politics-and-government/nevada/heres-why-nevadans-wont-see-relief-from-a-federal-gas-tax-holiday-2533621/

  4. Anonymous says:

    So then if something has no benefit that this columnist can measure for the State of Nevada, then doing it on a federal level is futile?

    Geez that’s some shortsightedness.

    Maybe consider the possibility that if people saved more money on gas, that they’d be more likely to take a trip to Las Vegas (Imagining for a moment that some of those people live in Southern California) than if say they had to pay more for gas.

    There, there’s your non futile effort right?

    Problem solved.

  5. Anonymous says:

    And I hate to break it to Jim Hartman but according to the law of supply and demand if the green agenda succeeds there will be far less of a demand for gasoline which means the price of oil would drop rather dramatically so see you can have the green agenda and low gas prices.

    Maybe this new information will lead him to support the green agenda?

  6. Rincon says:

    As Churchill said, The greatest argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter. Daryl is correct in his observation. The same thing happens when voters credit of blame the economy on whoever happens to be in power at the time, as if no other factors could possibly have influence.

  7. Athos says:

    “if the green agenda succeeds…” you mean like in 2050 AD or so? Or after the world’s currency is the Chinese RMB? Notice how Russia (and China) aren’t trying to destroy their economies over a computer model predicting world disaster 100 years from now (and hasn’t been correct over the last 50 years)! Fools. If the apocalypse is coming then why not nuclear power? And how about the prophets of doom stop adding to the pollution by flying all over and owning mansions on the oceanfront?
    This is Biden’s mistake. Following the “green agenda” has crippled our country (and Europe) and enriched and emboldened Russia. But like all prideful fools, he can’t admit his mistake and restore the Trump era oil and gas production. Lefties have no shame!

    They just pass a meaningless 18 cent gas reduction that doesn’t effect Nevada. Good luck with that Cortez Masto! We have CLOWNS not leaders. Maybe Titus and Lee can be bounced out as congress critters. Worthless, corrupt, bankrupt of values.

  8. NYPete says:

    “like all prideful fools, he can’t admit his mistake and restore the Trump era oil and gas production.”

    In 2020 the U.S. produced 11.28 barrels of crude oil per day. In 2022 the U.S. is estimated to produce 11.85 million barrels per day.

  9. Anonymous says:

    The internet allows even fools and children who just say stuff to say stuff.

    I remember a time, seems better to me, when parents taught their children to remain silent lest the world realize that they are fools and children.

    Athos sure can tap those keys can’t he?

  10. Anonymous says:

    From people who don’t just say stuff to hear themselves talk. (And coincidentally just from today’s headlines)

  11. Athos says:

    The NYT is a former news paper. They major in woke news. And comparing 2022 to 2020 oil production doesn’t explain why Brandon had to raid the oil reserves last November (and may do so again, now), does it? Since our number 1 importer is our fascist Canadian neighbors, maybe senile buffoon shouldn’t have caved to the greenies and shut down the Keystone Pipeline. (And hopefully, our Northern neighbors will throw that wanna be tyrant out on his ear!)

    And neither anny or petey addressed Xi and Putin’s disregard for your precious global warming goddess, did you? Thus emboldening Putin to move into Ukraine (I typed that last part real slow so you guys could understand it).

    You see fellas, there are those among us that won’t shut up and stop shining the light on reality. Don’t know why you enjoy the dark so much. MAGA stands for a return to our founding constitutional principles of freedom, God and Country. Your woke manure doesn’t work and produces misery in the lives of those you inflict it upon.

  12. Oh omniscient narcissisitc one; I bought my floaties in 1989 but didn’t need them. AL Gore started a climate credit sales outfit in 2004 then scared the fuck out of you in 2006 – Hmmm. The East Anglia University liars falsified the data on the medieval warming period then when caught falsely claimed it was a localized North Atlantic phenomena, a North Atlantic phenomena that ended Anasazi culture in the American Southwest, the end of it cause the bow and arrow wars in Western Alaska and warming in Patagonia. Global cooling Younger Dryas some believe killed off Clovis Man after it warmed up again the Folsom people thrived. Oh I could go on buy why bother 🙂

    Cheers,

    PS, get the socialism out of climate change legislation and maybe more will believe you.

    https://wattsupwiththat.com/2019/06/30/30-year-anniversary-of-the-un-1989-10-years-to-save-the-world-climate-warning/

  13. Athos says:

    One more thing, you say “…I remember a time, seems better to me, when parents taught their children to remain silent lest the world realize that they are fools and children…” when the truth is pointed out to you, but say nothing when your high priest John Kerry makes a laughingstock out of himself worrying about Climate Change while tanks are rolling into the Ukraine!

    Talk about being totally self unaware!

  14. Anonymous says:

    Daryl just one question:

    Did you read the IPCC’s most recent report? And as to whether more people will “believe” me when whatever presumed socialism there is in climate change legislation is gotten rid of is really irrelevant right? I mean, the issue of climate change isn’t about belief because this it is not opinion so whether you believe it or not doesn’t really change it.

    I would be interested in knowing whether you’ve actually read any of the most recent report though because that would give me some insight into how much weight to give the things you say about it.

    Thanking you in advance!

    And Athos, you’re a child and you need to think more and tap those keys less.

  15. Anonymous says:

    Fair enough

    How much did you read?

  16. The press release. Sounds like Chicken Little. Every report is more dire and urgent than the previous one.

  17. Thomas, yes, they have cried wolf to many times as well as being caught for lying and denying truth in information requests. If the wanter us to believe them they wouldn’t have lied. I have also followed the money.

    omniscient one, I may consider reading one after the glaciers near my home melt as they did in the Medieval Warming Period, you know the one, it coincided with the draught they ended the Mayan Empire.

    A little something I wrote for my column in 2006
    http://www.greater-yellowstone.com/5-2006/Liberals-Venus.html

  18. NYPete says:

    “And neither anny or petey addressed Xi and Putin’s disregard for your precious global warming goddess, did you? Thus emboldening Putin to move into Ukraine.”

    Putin invaded Ukraine because of global warming?

  19. And why is Biden not blocking Putin from selling his most valuable asset … oil and gas? Politics trumps climate apocalypse.

  20. Anonymous says:

    Thomas, seriously, is it possible that the reason you perceive each report as being more dire is because instead of reading the actual reports you rely on what other people (presumably people that you typically rely upon for their opinions) that those people’s opinions about what is being written is more dire? And is it even possible in your eyes that the reason this is happening is because the situation is becoming more dire? And really, how would you really know without at least giving the report some attention?

    Well Dayrl I appreciate the honesty but hopefully you can understand why someone, from outside people who also don’t read what the report says, might view your opinion about that report as less than informed and thus dismiss the things you say right?

    Which, is not the same as what you did by any means since we, or at least I, actually read and considered what you said.

    And this is probably the biggest reason why there is the skew in the world today between those who believe that belief has anything to do with whether man made climate change is having the impact science demonstrates is occurring, and those who don’t.

  21. Anonymous says:

    Thomas you ask why Biden isn’t blocking Putin from selling his most valuable asset even while you know the answer in part is that it would increase the price of gas which would adversely affect the world and most importantly Americans so what’s the pretending about?

    And let me just say that it seems likely that he will take this step even if he hasn’t already, in spite of the political problems it will cause him but importantly he has not taken every action he could have from the very first day of the war so as to allow Russia to maybe possibly consider their actions and the rising costs and back off. Which seems reasonable to me course that something that hasn’t been the policy in this country for a few years so maybe we’ve just forgotten what being reasonable is all about right?

  22. Oh Omniscient One, I’l bet Thomas takes all new reports with a grain of salt chased with the 26 ounces of Mortons in the easy pour carton is because none of the rest of the reported dooms day predictions came true, re-watch Gore’s horror movie. You have to hand it to the sly dog though between his carbon trading company and that lying mover he put a cool quarter billion in his pocket if just a few short years. He though would have been as rich as Joseph Rickets though if his Cap and Trade fraud would have passed in 2010. Follow the money.

    Biden doesn’t care about the price of fuel or else he wouldn’t of wrote a dozen executive orders to screw us out of domestic energy and nearby Canadian oil and the tens of thousands of ancillary jobs that go with them. The reason he has tripled Russian oil imports is so democrats get slaughtered less in Novemember 2022. Even though I will be slaughtered in the pocket because I have a hundred mile round trip to the doctor or a 120 mile round trip to work. I’d like to see you blinded by ideology folks not import any foreign oil so you can prove green energy is just a pipe dream today. Buy democrat rank and file appreciate the virtue signaling lies of shutting down oil here while the lying leaders sneaking it in the back door there to make up for the reckless paucity of supply they created. After all, there are sheep to convince in November.

    I do though believe that the middle has awakened to both the shock at the pump, the shock at the grocery store and the shock of our Ineptocracy foreign policy. You are getting slaughtered at the mid-terms. http://www.free-press.biz/usa/gore/algore.html

  23. Athos says:

    “Putin invaded Ukraine because of global warming?…” Ah, petey. Guess I didn’t type it slow enough for you to understand, did I? Read it again real slow this time (and let me know what words you’re having trouble with so I can help you, OK?)

    Your computer model has been a farce of a failure and to base our economic well being on something that “may” happen 80 years from now, is clownish, at best, and juvenile at its worst. (You fellas really following the advice of an emotionally unstable Swedish teenager? and you call me a child? Physician, heal thyself!)

    The world sees how corrupt and unserious the West has become. Boys winning sporting events for girls, men being celebrated as the first or smartest women alive. Restorative justice destroying order and discipline in our school system as our children are taught that boys can be girls and visa versa. Parents being denied access by the schools as to their children’s gender confusion. And Canada’s insane law preventing any kind of normalcy from parents’ advice to their own children.

    Just because facebook and twitter can ban the truth and the woke mob can intimidate sane people from speaking out against this nonsense doesn’t mean the rest of the world isn’t following it. Some people value morals over money. I know that sounds strange, but believe it or not, it’s true. And we’re actually seeing it in real time in the Ukraine!

    Muslims don’t kill infidels because they are out of work, or haven’t had a proper diet. They believe their god tells them to do it, and so they do. You better believe Xi and Putin are hoping for a world where the US isn’t the dominant force. And fitting pregnant women for fighter-pilot flight suits doesn’t put the fear of God in their twisted souls, fellas.

    Go figure…..

  24. NYPete says:

    Oh, I see – now it’s “Putin invaded Ukraine because of pronouns.”

  25. Athos says:

    Hey, I think you’re really getting closer, petey! I know it’s scary to look inward, and face reality, but you will be the better man for going there….

    So….try it again,,,and remember, I’m here to help you

  26. NYPete says:

    Lol, you really believe that stuff.

  27. Rincon says:

    Someone PLEASE tell me how you decided that the computer models for global warming in the ’90’s were wrong. I see lots of unsupported opinions here, but little information. To borrow from myself, the models included in the 1992 IPCC report predicted an increase in global temperature of 0.3 to1.0 degrees Celcius by 2025, depending upon how much greenhouse gas emissions changed during that time. https://www.ipcc.ch/site/assets/uploads/2018/05/ipcc_90_92_assessments_far_overview.pdf
    Since the temperature has risen about 0.5 degrees Celcius by now (2022), I think they were right on target, especially considering that our rate of emissions has slowed during the interim (negating the high end figure), and we still have three more years of likely warming before 2025.
    https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/world-of-change/global-temperatures

    When scientists correctly predicted not only that warming would continue to rise from 1992-2022, but accurately estimated the degree of warming to expect, why should I believe the .skeptics who told us for decades that the earth wasn’t really warming (they said the measurements were wrong). Then, when proven completely wrong, they said the warming was stopping. That too was completely off the mark, and now, after being proven completely wrong twice, they say that although we’re warming a lot, it’s a natural warming, although they don’t have the faintest idea how or why it’s happening. Why should I be willing to bet the farm that they are right after they were wrong twice, when the mainstream was right on the money?

    BTW, please consider finding out some detail about the medieval warming period. Hopefully, you would consider the Encyclopedia Brittanica a reasonably unbiased source: https://www.britannica.com/science/medieval-warm-period

    As for the price of oil, I fact checked that. These two sources (the first two that popped up) do not support Daryl’s assertion that we tripled our imports of oil from Russia:
    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-03-01/u-s-imports-of-russian-crude-oil-have-been-dropping-for-months
    https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2022/feb/28/maria-bartiromo/us-did-not-double-oil-imports-russia-last-year/

    Unfortunately Daryl, your other sources also appear to some of us, to be a touch biased. From Wikipedia: “Watts Up With That? (WUWT) is a blog[1] promoting climate change denial[7] that was created by Anthony Watts in 2006.” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Watts_Up_With_That%3F
    Your other reference was too little to be readily vetted, but I think the name, Citizens for a Freer America, writing the title, “Al Gore” Chicken Little Global Warming Alarmist And Con Man” tells me what I need to know. How would you feel if I used Greenpeace as a source?

  28. Athos says:

    I’m here for you, little buddy!

  29. Rincon, Citizens for a freer America is a website I started after my son was born and I learned we had a 5.6 trillion dollar national debt.

    You environmental idiots put our oil producers out of business, then make up the gap with foreign oil so you have a bandaid to save your next election; Blood oil that rains as missiles onto Ukraine. You hypocrite, enemy enablers piss me off.

    I get some of my knowledge of the environmentalists from Greenpeace founder Patrick Moore that blew the whistle on his organization that went off the rails.

    What I said on m y Al Gore Page were linked and true, timeline was true and you bought his line of shit hook line and sinker.

  30. NYPete says:

    So very, very worried about the national debt, yet you had no objection at all to a multi-trillion tax cut to upper income brackets and corporations.

  31. Oh Pete you poor envious soul, 80% of us got a tax cut, to bad your boat wasn’t in the water for the rising tide. Or maybe you just don’t understand that when your 401K or Roth goes up 10%, that the same 10% for your Obama will be a larger sum. The tax cut subtracted nothing from the National Treasury. Or maybe you can become an entrepreneur so you can admire those that succeed instead of an envious dude that covets with jealousy.

  32. Athos says:

    Can you see how blind you are worrying about the earth warming some percentage of a degree, while thousands are dying in the Ukraine, Rin? And our main political enemies (no I don’t mean Trump) being Iran, Russia and China, don’t give 2 hoots about global warming or banning coal fired energy plants or gas/oil production. They want a world dominated by someone other than the US (Chinese destiny, anyone?)

    Consequently, they consider you green freaks as clowns (and useful idiots). Fiddling while Rome burns.

    Please tell me you’re not so far up Gaia’s rectum that you can acknowledge this? What good will come from living in Chinese dominated world, Rin? Is that the inheritance you wish to leave posterity?

    And for the record, Algore is a scam artist that DID predict things that did not come true, right??

  33. Athos, the libs here are to myopic to see beyond their boogy man of choice. They aren’t intellectually honest enough to make their Biden puppeteers not augment the oil production they took away from the USA. They are so tunnel visioned on global warming the don’t give a crap about extra air pollution caused by the 2+million illegal aliens they ushered over the border last year and for the next four until sanity can resume again on 1/20/2025. I asked my liberal sister in California how she like saving her water ration with 1.8 million illegal aliens and instead of defending it she just said; “we won’t talk about that”. because it can’t be defended. In the 80s the Sierra Club was against illegal immigration until the DNC made them get in line.

    Most of the lecturers on global warming can’t tell you why it was warmer in the Medieval Warming Period than it is now if in fact they have heard of the Medieval Warming Period at all. The Sahara Desert was once a lush savannah until 20,000 years ago Fred Flintstone and Barney started running around it in their car.

    STATEMENT OF UNDISPUTED MATERIAL FACTS IN SUPPORT OF DEFENDANT STEYN’S MOTION FOR SUMMARY JUDGMENT

    Click to access 10974.pdf

  34. NYPete says:

    Immigration causes air pollution — I like that. Great analysis there!

  35. You don’t think they drive cars, we are likely up to 40 million illegal aliens but even it was just the eleven million that was a consensus in 2006 + the 2 million you ushered over the border in 2021 that is a lot of cars on the road, that wouldn’t have been. psst, last years Illegal immigration was 4 times the population of Wyoming and this will happen for the next 4 years. That makes water have to be spread thinner, more pressure on the price of homes. But they will likely vote democrat for a decade until they realize they are supporting all things non-catholic, that democrats piss on family values and by the tenth year a good portion of them will be common sense businessmen and then will switch to voting republican.

    This country has gone from 165 million people when I was born to 330 million now. Just why do you want more traffic and everything in your life to cost more money.

    Now make you argument that millions of people aren’t driving cars. only a fraction of people use mass transit.

  36. NYPete says:

    Only 40 million? I wish we had more. We need all that human capital.

  37. Are you a landscape contractor or something trying to get cheap labor and undermining your offsprings ability to earn, buy a home? Or maybe you are just a childless liberal that has no progeny to consider! Childless liberals are the worst busy bodys.

  38. NYPete says:

    Nope – plenty of thriving kids. But our population is aging out and we need more workers and more young people or else we will end up stagnant. Immigrants — from wherever — are always the best bet. Ambitious, hard-working, entrepreneurial. And we have plenty of room for them. So Mr. Biden, tear down that wall!

  39. Oh, to shore up your social security Ponzi scheme, I understand you better now.

  40. NYPete says:

    No, to cover your Medicare costs. And to grow gdp.

  41. Yes, we will need a bigger GDP to cover you freeloaders and benefits. Damn I hate you America haters. Psst, you want a bigger GDP, drill for domestic oil idiot.

  42. NYPete says:

    If you love America you should want there to be more people in America. We can put the to work installing solar panels and wind turbines.

  43. LOL, put down the pipe. My time is up on this thread.

  44. Athos says:

    I’m sure we could import a few million Ukrainians, right? What they wouldn’t give to have 2nd amendment rights!

    Now, where did we put all those Afghans Brandon brought over?

  45. NYPete says:

    I am proud to say we have some Afghan families in my town. Beautiful children and I am glad that they will be part of the legacy of ceaseless immigration that lies at the core of American exceptionalism.

  46. NYPete says:

    Looks like another great job by Brandon in managing the economy in February through incredible domestic and foreign uncertainty: 678,000 jobs added in the past month, for a total of 7.9 million jobs since the end of 2020. More than half a million jobs per month for more than a year.
    Good thing that we are getting more immigrants from Mexico, Ukraine and Afganistan to help satisfy all that demand.

  47. Anonymous says:

    Now you’re just being cruel.

  48. Athos says:

    Wow petey, we’re inching up on Feb 2020 job numbers, aren’t we? Maybe after the midterms we can finally get there! (Just a shame Trump isn’t in charge, cause we’d already be there!)

    “I am proud to say we have some Afghan families in my town.” At least they were IN the plane instead of trying to hold on from the outside (which is a true JoeBiden moment, wasn’t it?)! And did we ever get all the Americans home from Afghanistan, yet?

  49. NYPete says:

    Yeah, sure takes time to recover from the disastrous job numbers that Trump left us with in January 2021. But weird of you to say we are “inching back.” Under Brandon’s administration we have added 7.4 million jobs and have experienced the fastest economic growth in 40 years! And that is in the middle of a pandemic and global war and turmoil. Let’s go!

  50. Rincon says:

    Wow, 5 days pass, and I missed….not all that much. There are a few facts scattered throughout the various diatribes, but they seem mostly to be composed of various insults and rantings. I’ll focus on the actual information presented.

    Re: The tax cut and deficits,

    Daryl said, “The tax cut subtracted nothing from the National Treasury.” OK, where’s the evidence? I do have some suggesting that tax cuts do not pay for themselves:

    The national debt starting in 2013 as a % of GDP was: In the last 4 Obama years (The first 4 were higher, but most economists urged spending more after the worst recession since the ’30’s. After that, it was good times) 4.0%, 2.8%, 2.4%, 3.1%. In the first three Trump years 3.4, 3.8, 4.6. So Obama averaged 3.1%. while Trump averaged 3.9%, which was 25% higher. Not proof of anything, but suggestive. Combine that with the same pattern seen over most or all of the tax cuts in the last 40 years, and it becomes a pretty solid possibility that tax cuts increase the deficit. Reagan in particular almost tripled our national debt, after his much ballyhooed tax cuts. So circumstantial evidence suggests a negative effect of tax cuts on the deficit. Again, where’s the countervailing evidence?
    https://www.thebalance.com/us-deficit-by-year-3306306

    “an you see how blind you are worrying about the earth warming some percentage of a degree, while thousands are dying in the Ukraine, Rin?”
    Shortly afterward, Daryl writes, “They are so tunnel visioned on global warming the don’t give a crap about extra air pollution caused by the 2+million illegal aliens they ushered over the border last year” So Athos, why do you not scold Daryl for worrying about immigration while we should remained focused on Ukraine? News flash: In the long run, global warming may be a far greater problem than Russia. Immigration? More of an irritant, especially when we have so many jobs unfilled. BTW, with greenhouse gases, whether an alien is driving in the U.S. or south of the border is irrelevant, so illegal immigration has next to nothing to do with global warming.

    You obviously didn’t read the article about the medieval warming period either. You can lead a horse to water…

  51. Athos says:

    Wow. Hat tip to Rin, you sir, are a true Gaia believer, aren’t you? If Putin’s reality can’t make you break away from the screeching rantings of a unbalanced Swedish teenager, I wonder what will?

    Just paid $5.20 for a gal of gas tonight. You happy about that, Rin? How are you championing the poor and underclass when they’re getting killed at the gas pump?

    And under what rock do you find evidence that the government spends better than the wage earner? Spending other peoples money is bedrock political strategy, but that doesn’t make it moral or the right thing to do, does it?

    What a minute, did you make Peter Schweizer’s new book “Red-Handed: How American Elites Get Rich Helping China Win”?? Is that where you’re coming from, Rin? Not an insult, just trying to figure out where you get off…

  52. NYPete says:

    I would be happy to pay even more at the pump if it would mean further cutting off Russia’s oil revenues.

  53. Athos says:

    So answer me this, O Great One…… What makes Russian, Venezuelan and Iranian oil eco friendly, but American Oil is so bad for the planet, we can’t get Brandon to approve of restoring Trump’s energy policies, (and putting us on the path to net energy exporter)?

  54. NYPete says:

    Unbelievable – we already are a net energy exporter.
    And all fossil fuels lead to the emission of heat-trapping gasses. That is why we need to find ways to discourage their use before Nevada becomes even more uninhabitable.

  55. Not a net exporter any more.

  56. Anonymous says:

    As of February 18, 2022 we are a net exporter. For whatever that means and for whatever its worth.

    https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=51338#:~:text=Net%20exports%20of%20refined%20petroleum,about%20the%20same%20in%202021.

  57. A temporary phenom.

  58. Anonymous says:

    If you say so

    I wonder how you feel about American oil companies declining to pump more oil even while prices have never been higher based on their belief that they need to show “discipline” given what happened to oil prices the last time they pumped as much as they could and whether its appropriate to blame anyone other than them for not doing their share to help the country in its hour of need?

  59. NYPete says:

    Yeah, it is true the oil exporter/importer stuff is pretty bogus. Any economist or oil man will tell you that. Oil is oil and prices are global.
    Anyway, we would all be better off driving electric cars.

  60. Rincon says:

    In case you’re not sure, Athos, most of us are able to consider more than one issue at a time.
    Sorry if you can’t. I’m still concerned about global warming, but my hat’s off to Ukraine. I am happy to support them in any way we can.

    Gasoline is a huge bargain. There’s more energy in a gallon than 15 days worth of food for the average person – for a whole $5.20. And at 65 cents a pint, it’s still cheaper than a lot of bottled water. You’re just mad because it used to be an even greater bargain. You can be sure it’s not breaking many people, since Americans have greatly increased the size of their vehicles over the years. The average vehicle in the U.S. weighs 4156 lbs., even with the extensive use of aluminum and plastics. A Toyota Corolla, which is considered a midsize car, is about 3,000 lbs. I echo NY Pete’s willingness to pay even more if it benefits Ukraine. Only the financially desperate or the selfish would be unwilling. BTW, the gas taxes don’t come even close to paying for the roads, only one of the many subsidies for petroleum. And the reason frackers slowed production is just good old fashioned capitalism. Nothing wrong with that.

  61. Athos says:

    Rin, you and petey are a couple of elitist a-holes that only care about themselves. Talk about selfish! The sad thing is you probably DON’T know anyone “financially desperate”, do you? Just have Brandon send them another check, right? Socialism is the true way! Believe it or not, there are people that are cutting their food budget to pay for their fuel increase. And all those truckers just love saving the planet while getting you your wild goose liver pate, and paying out the nose for diesel)

    I’m sorry to rain on your parade but the Lennon song “Imagine” is NOT reality. There are borders, there is a God and there is definitely greed AND hunger in this world. Just ask the people in Ukraine while you “happily support them” paying more money at the pump to pilot your EV. (Nice tax incentive getting that vehicle, huh?) And just exactly where is all that gas tax money to fix the roads? Should we ask Mayor Pete? (is he back from maternity leave, yet?)

  62. Athos says:

    And it was the affect of Joe Biden that slowed the frackers’ production. NOT capitalism. You got to stop living in the fantasy world of CNN, Rin. Of course, it does go better with your Socialist/ Green wet dream, doesn’t it?

  63. NYPete says:

    Truckers don’t deliver my wild goose liver paté.
    I have it delivered by private jet so it stays fresh.

  64. Rincon says:

    Your senseless rant and failure to respond to evidence presented makes you look childish. Calling anyone an a-hole on a forum such as this defeats its purpose. It’s divisive people like you that encourage Putin and Xi to change the world order. They view us as a bunch of vacuous, argumentative, and ineffectual partisans. Unfortunately, they aren’t far off. Try presenting evidence for your beliefs. That, I could respect.

  65. Athos says:

    There is no evidence to change the mind of one so invested as you, Rin. Whatever is presented, you can only see what you want to see. Care to bet on where the Ukrainians rate global warming on the top ten things of importance?

    Childish? ” It’s divisive people like you that encourage Putin and Xi to change the world order.” And your mother wears combat boots! (On a positive note, at least you acknowledge Putin and Xi WANT to change the world order! I guess that’s a start.)

    Just pointing out the obvious but Putin didn’t attack during the Trump presidency. Bush, Georgia. Obama, Crimea. Trump (nope). Biden, Ukraine. Maybe Trump was more than just bluster, eh? And let’s not forget Bubba BJ Clinton promising Ukraine that the US would be there if they just gave up their nukes in ’94, right?

    And just to put things in their proper perspective, Putin still has a Twitter account, and Trump doesn’t. How can that be, Mr. Anti-divisive?

  66. NYPete says:

    “Will Putin become my new best friend?” — Donald Trump, 2013
    “The people of Crimea would rather be with Russia.” Donald Trump, 2016
    “Do you think Americans care about Ukraine?” Mike Pompeo, 2019
    “Ukraine, to be technical, is not a democracy. And by the way, Ukraine is a pure client state of the United States State Department.” Tucker Carlson, 2021
    “The Trump campaign worked behind the scenes last week to make sure the new Republican platform won’t call for giving weapons to Ukraine to fight Russian and rebel forces, contradicting the view of almost all Republican foreign policy leaders in Washington.” Washington Post, 2016
    “President Putin was incredibly strong and powerful today,” Donald Trump, 2018
    “I went in yesterday and there was a television screen, and I said, ‘This is genius.’ Putin declares a big portion of Ukraine — Putin declares it as independent. Oh, that’s wonderful.” Donald Trump, February 2022

  67. NYPete says:

    Oh, and this gem from the newest Republican star:
    “Remember that Zelenskyy is a thug.” Madison Cawthorne, March 5, 2022

  68. Athos says:

    So you’re fine with Putin still having a Twitter account, petey? And tell me, who said the following:
    “Putin may circle Kyiv with tanks, but he’ll never gain the hearts and souls of the Iranian people,”

    Who’s darling said that one, petey?

  69. Athos says:

    And just to be clear…..Putin invaded Ukraine during what President, again?

  70. Athos says:

    “This just exposes how insane it is that … we rely on energy from authoritarian leaders and we are not self-reliant on our own energy.” —MSNBC’s Katy Tu

    “Sending Kamala Harris to Poland to solve the Ukrainian crisis is like sending Dr. Jill Biden to do heart surgery.” —Charlie Kirk

  71. NYPete says:

    Responding to Athos always reminds me of what my pappy used to say back on the farm: “Never wrestle with the pig; you both get dirty and the pig likes it.”

    In the real world, one could disagree with the Biden administration on a thousand issues, and yet still agree that it has managed the Ukraine crisis quite well. The intelligence assessments were completely correct. The strategic deployment of those assessments was very well done. The President’s success in unifying the Western response — something that took Putin completely by surprise — was remarkable. The sanctions have been brilliantly conceived.

    You may now return to complaining about woke college students and tax credits for chiildren.

  72. Athos says:

    “The average gas price in America hit an all-time record high of over $4 per gallon. OK, that stings, but a clean conscience is worth a buck or two. … I am willing to pay $4 a gallon. Hell, I’ll pay $15 a gallon because I drive a Tesla.” —Stephen Colbert Completely toned death.

    So your “pappy” used to say that, huh? Figures. The actual quote is “Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and irritates the pig”. My “pappy” told me “you’re gonna drive me to drinking if you don’t stop driving that hot…..rod…..Lincoln”

    And Biden’s handling of the Ukraine crisis is perfect if his intent was to get people’s attention away from our REAL problems (rampant inflation, the crisis at OUR border, and the sexual attack on our children) into another botched foreign policy blunder.

    This administration is still a buffoonish clown show!

  73. NYPete says:

    This is what Republicans have turned into: “Athos” believes that the Biden Administration convinced Putin to invade a sovereign democratic country in order to distract Americans’ attention from “sexual attack on our children.”

  74. Athos says:

    “Athos” believes that the Biden Administration convinced Putin to invade a sovereign democratic country in order to distract Americans’ attention from “sexual attack on our children.”
    Why do you lie, petey? Could it possibly be because your values have failed in every society they’ve been tried, and your only possible way forward is to lie, telling the rest of us to “shut up”?

    Aren’t you tired of continually telling people that what they see with their own eyes and experience in their own lives is a falsehood? Your party (the left wing of the Democrat party that currently rules thru Biden) has continually stated that coal, gas and oil must be discontinued (in order to fall in line with a computer model that predicts Earth’s end in 2000, no wait, 2009, no wait, 2011, no wait 2030, yeah, that’s the ticket) and renewable energy will fill the our energy needs very soon. In the meanwhile, us rubes need to suck it up. You guys have stated that you WANT high energy prices and when you get them, you say it’s Putin’s fault! Or the Oil companies fault (because they don’t want to drill to find and sell more oil) or God only knows what ever clap trap that passes for logic in your camp.

    You’re broken, petey. But you’re too proud to admit it. So you revert to misquotes and outright lies to try to justify your pitiful, shameful existence. I pity you. And believe it or not, I’m praying for you.

    Just come towards the light, petey. It’s never too late.

  75. NYPete says:

    I wrote what all rational people believe: that the Biden Administration’s handling of the present crisis has been well-executed. You responded that that could only be true if the Administration’s intent was to create a crisis in order to distract attention from “sexual attack on our children” (whatever that means). You don’t think the Administration’s response has been well-executed, so there is only one other interpretation of what you think.

  76. Anonymous says:

    “Just remember, what you are seeing and what you are reading is not what’s happening,”
    -Trump

  77. Athos says:

    Nice try, petey. You are certainly not in the camp of rational people. You left defense when Trump was elected and the lies were all you had. It’s actually gotten worse when this senile shell of a former grifter – Biden (who’s never been a leader, only a follower) was elected. All your media allies, all your White House spokespeople, all your congress critter leaders spew untruths day in and day out. And when they are caught, they ignore it and continue lying about some other subject. (kinda like you, old buddy!)

    But to your specific point, I’ll direct your attention to the law just passed in Florida (and also in Iowa and one of the Dakotas) that forbids schools to discus sex, sexual orientation and gender fluid studies with children in 3rd grade and below. Of course, your boy in the WH and his p-spokesperson label it as Don’t Say Gay! which is not in the bill nor is it relevant (but hey, at least it rolls off the tongue, right?)

    Why any person would WANT to talk about sex or sexual identity with children that age OTHER than the parent(s) is not exactly clear to me. Maybe you have some insight, eh? In my world, those people would be called perverts and would be arrested. But your “side” (which is hardly rational) doesn’t see it that way, do you? You’ve actually elevated “gaslighting” to a new level of artwork!

  78. Athos says:

    You left THAT defense……

    really need an editor to correct copy

  79. NYPete says:

    So my friend who teaches a third grade class could not, during a discussion of the meaning of Thanksgiving, mention that she and her wife were having their extended family over for the holiday. But the teacher in the next classroom could mention that he and his wife were having their family over for dinner. That is because to you my friend would be engaging in a “sexual attack.”

  80. NYPete says:

    You see, to you the fact that my friend has a wife is (in your words,) “perversion.” So is the fact that someone might have a different gender identity than the one they were born with. Liberals like me believe that the advancement of LGBTQ rights since the Anita Byrant days is one of the great moral advancements of American society. Conservative like you think it is perversion.

  81. Athos says:

    Wow, petey, you’re 2 for 2 in the “nice try” category! Why do you love to contribute words to me, that I haven’t said? And how long have you been hanging on to this resentment, to resurrect the ghost of Anita Bryant? And for your information, nowhere in the Florida bill does it stop your “friend” from mentioning her Thanksgiving plans! She’s simply prohibited from the following:

    “A school district may not encourage classroom discussion about sexual orientation or gender identity in primary grade levels or in a manner that is not age-appropriate or developmentally appropriate for students.”

    So your friend can rest easy, petey! As to the “perversion” aspect, that is above my pay grade (in other words, it’s up to God to judge) but my personal feelings are marriage has meant something specific to our genealogy since the dawn of time. It happens to center around the propitiation of our race (mother/father giving birth to children) Sex is not fluid, nor will I be forced to believe such an obvious lie.
    You can be an effeminate man or a masculine woman but you’d still be a man, and you’d still be a woman. And trying to peddle that transgender trope onto impressionable children is wrong. And a falsehood and now, in the state of Florida, able to get you sued!

  82. NYPete says:

    1. So, you are not quite sure whether being gay or a lesbian is a “perversion,” but you do know that you oppose gay and lesbian Americans having the right to marry.
    2. Not entirely clear whether you feel a student or teacher should be legally prohibited about mentioning his or her gay family. But should be interesting to see how the ambiguous language of the Don’t Say Gay law is interpreted district by district, jury by jury.

  83. Athos says:

    1. You are now 3 FOR 3 in the “nice try, but I didn’t say that” category, petey! If jumping to conclusions was an Olympic event, you would be world classless. After having spelled out how marriage has been defined for millennium, I shifted into stating basic biology 101, and how I will not participate in the charade of gender fluidity. BTW, how do you think our feminist feel about a man taking the top USA Today “Woman of the Year” award?

    2. Nowhere in the bill does it say “Don’t Say Gay”, does it? And why would I want any teacher/ administrator or guidance counselor talking to my kindergartner about homosexuality, anyway? Are you telling me that you are OK with this? (you see, instead of jumping to conclusions and accusing you of being on board with teaching young kids about sex, I asked you instead. That’s how adults discuss ideas!)

    3. Bonus round (for petey or rinny) How close are we to being able to run our country purely on renewable energy? Next year? maybe by 2025? 2030? xxxx???

    4. Double bonus round (for anyone strong enough to answer) according to the WSJ, China is trying very hard to buy Saudi Oil in RMB (or yuan) thus replacing the US dollar (and the possible collapse of the petrodollar and US supremacy). Any truth to this, and what is our fearless leader Let’s go Brandon doing about this?

  84. NYPete says:

    1. You keep talking about kindergarden, yet thel law applies to all the way to grade 12. Why do you keep leaving that out?
    2. I think it is perfectly proper, in a 2d grade classroom discussion of national holidays, for a teacher to mention that her wife’s family is coming to their house for Thankgsgiving. Do you? If so, do you think the Don’t Say Gay law is clear that she can do so without risking career-ending consequences?
    3. Similarly, do you think it clear that a middle-school course in 20th Century American history can include a discussion of the Stonewall Riots or the assassination of Harvey Milk? Would a high school discussion of Obergefell v. Hodges be “developmentally appropriate”? Are you ready for that issue to be turned into jury trials in a thousand communities?
    4. I have no idea what you are talking about w/r/t renewable energy. And the idea of the Saudi’s accepting Yuan for their oil is farcical.

  85. NYPete says:

    BTW, Putin’s contemptuous references today to “so-called gender freedom” show that he must be a big fan of DeSantis’s “Don’t Say Gay” law.

  86. Athos says:

    1. Because the law applies to up to grade 3. Although I have no problem with it going to grade 12. You see, I’m actually the parent of 3 children and I take my job seriously.

    2. You really need to read the law. What possible purpose does your teacher friend ( or any teacher in a relationship) hope to promote telling their kids, their personal business plans? Teach my kids to read, write, spell, math, science and civics and let me (as their parent) take care of their sexual and religious instruction.That is the traditional role of parents.

    3. It would be better for the cohesiveness of this country (the United States of America) if history were taught to uplift this country and instill pride in what we’ve accomplished. Middle School history and High School History have limited time to teach what’s right about America (as opposed to airing our dirty linen in order to promote disrespect for our country)

    4. The “farcical” idea that you cite was from an article in the Wall Street Journal. 3/15/22 “Saudi Arabia Considers Accepting Yuan Instead of Dollars for Chinese Oil Sales” Got your attention, yet?

    And of course you have no idea when America can rely only on renewable energy, even though our Pres and Transport sec. just tell us to “buy a Tesla, rubes”. My point is that we may SOMEDAY be totally wind and solar, but that day is certainly not in the foreseeable future, so we should get busy with our own abundant energy resources that will also give us more strength.

    PS. Putin is evil. DeSantis lives in the real world, was correct about Covid, and supports the rights of parents instead of Randy Weingarten and the teacher’s unions.

  87. NYPete says:

    1. No, the “Don’t Say Gay” law applies to all education up to seniors in high school. Here is the text: “Classroom instruction by school personnel or third parties on se”Classroom instruction by school personnel or third parties on sexual orientation or gender identity may not occur in kindergarten through grade 3 or in a manner that is not age appropriate or developmentally appropriate for students in accordance with state standards.” You really need to read the law. Or, learn what disjunctive means.
    2. You have now confirmed that the law prohibits a 3d grade teacher from mentioning her family during a classroom discussion of national holidays such as Thanksgiving. You consider that to be “sexual instruction.” I disagree and consider that to be further evidence of your deep-seated homophobia.
    3. You think that American History courses shouldn’t mention Jim Crow laws, the Trail of Tears, discrimination against gay Americans or the role of slavery in the early Republic. All that is merely “dirty linen” to you and detracts from what you see to be the true purpose of historical education, which is propaganda.
    4. Yes, the idea of Saudi Arabia abandoning the dollar for the yuan is farcical. Chum for rubes like you.

  88. Athos says:

    1. Gov DeSantis describes the bill as pertaining to 3rd grade and under. Which is what the bill actually says. You even quoted it yourself! Come back to reality, petey. Stop lying.

    2. OK, you were doing better but you blew it, petey and now you’re 4 for 4 in the “nice try, but I never said that” category. What’s up with that, liar? For the record, I believe that marriage based on a mother/father relationship is the cornerstone of our civilization. If 2 people are not in that relationship, I do not hate them, I only wish them well. Life is tough enough without hating people.

    3. The JimCrow laws (Democrat party, BTW), discrimination against gays and the role of slavery in the early Republic have all been rectified, haven’t they? Trail of Tears is another subject, altogether and does have some bearing with warring tribes and how the vanquished are treated by the conquerors, as studied thru out history. You may need to declare your patriotism and explain why you feel airing “dirty linen” detracts from how great our nation actually is, what a blessing we’ve been bestowed by God to live in this nation, and how you think that would be construed as “propaganda”. It almost sounds like you are ashamed of our country.

    4. Interesting how you call readers of the WSJ “rubes”. Are they lying? What do you base your opinion, petey?

  89. NYPete says:

    1.No, the bill applies to all grades, not just K-3. “Classroom instruction by school personnel or third parties on sexual orientation or gender identity may not occur in kindergarten through grade 3 or in a manner that is not age appropriate or developmentally appropriate for students in accordance with state standards.” In other words: (1) in K-3 grades no one who enters a classroom may “instruct on” (whatever that means) anything having to do with LGBT status; (2) in all other grades, no one who enters a classroom may talk about LGBT status “in a manner that is not age appropriate or developmentally appropriate … in accordance with state standards.” The language is disjunctive. It is a total ban in K-3; a partial ban in all other grades.
    2. Do you believe gay Americans should be permitted to marry?
    3. Should schools teach about the bad parts of American history or just the rah-rah parts?
    4. I didn’t say all readers of the WSJ are rubes. Just people like you.

  90. Athos says:

    1. Stop lying, petey. Join us in the real world where words have true meaning. Classroom instruction …. may not occur in K thru grade 3 ….. means exactly that. That is the trouble with leftist ideology that makes up words to misconstrue their true meaning (like abortion instead of infanticide; or CRT instead of racism/antiracism) that you have trouble recognizing plain language when it’s presented to you in very simple terms.

    2. Define “marry”. Once again, I believe that the mother/father union (traditional marriage for the purpose of raising the next generation) is the true cornerstone of our civilization.

    3. Define “rah-rah parts”. Do you mean 7/4/1776, the Louisiana Purchase, the Alamo, or the Civil War? The roaring 20s, the Great Depression, WW2, the fall of the Soviet Union, 9/11, Barry O’s election and presidency, MAGA?

    4. “Yes, the idea of Saudi Arabia abandoning the dollar for the yuan is farcical. Chum for rubes like you.” So you think the WSJ publishes articles to insult “people like you”? Define who “people like you” are.

  91. NYPete says:

    1. The law says what it says: you risk severe penalties for “instructing” (whatever that means) in grades K-3 that some people are married to people of the same sex, “or,” in all other grades, for saying anything about gay people in a manner that a local jury would later decide is not “developmentally appropriate.” Quite clear and quite bigoted.
    2. “Marry” means the legally and/or religiously recognized union of two people. Like most Americans, I believe that the right of gay Americans to marry is one of the great achievements of our society in the past 30 years. You are not willing to say that because you don’t believe gay Americans have the right to be married.
    3. Everything you define as the “rah-rah” parts is appropriate for instruction in American history classes. I believe that on the whole our country’s heritage is one to be celebrated. But even if I did not think so I would teach those events because they represent the truth. So does the first arrival of enslaved Africans in 1619, the link between slavery and early American prosperity, Jim Crow, suppression of gay rights, the internment of Japanese Americans, etc. But you are not willing to admit those parts of our history should be taught in schools because you have a Putin-esque approach to national history.
    4. I would define “people like you” as people who, like you have had their minds turned to mush by decades of talk radio and Fox News, who are consumed by resentful identity politics and who never bother to seek our information that might challenge their assumptions.

  92. Athos says:

    1. You’re now 5 for 5 in lying about what the bill actually says. Here’s another way you can look at it to help you understand, petey. Most parents (in fact, most decent adults) do not want children, ages 5 to 9 (K thru 3) to be subjected to gender and/or sex discussions, in school. The fact that there are people that think it’s perfectly fine to subjugate impressionable young minds with “gender fluid studies” is creepy and absolutely wrong. If you want to subject your own child (as his parent) to this sort of perversion (because it is a perversion against Nature and Nature’s God) that is up to you. We obviously have creepy perverts that want to destroy the innocence of the very young because this law had to be passed (and hopefully enforced). I’m of the age (and it really wasn’t that long ago) when none of this was necessary. Just to remind you (and to lead into point 2. ) it was less than 10 YEARS AGO, that President Zero was against gay marriage. Sure didn’t take you lefties that long to pervert our Societal norms, did it?

    3. I know you suffer from such clownish buffoons as Andrew Cuomo, and Bill DeBlasio, so your take on history is skewed into a morass of corruption. And if you think white skin makes you an evil oppressor and black skin makes you an innocent victim that needs reparations, is somehow Truth, then I question your motives for spreading such OBVIOUS lies, because that is the very definition of Racism. And just Who was our 44th President, petey? I didn’t personally like the content of his character (where DID he come from, any way? And why is he hobnobbing with all the rich white folk, huh?) but Barry Soetoro was elected President of this “systemically racist country” not once, but twice, wasn’t he? And the truth is I’m not the “Putin-esque” villain in this blog because I want to hold up Freedom as the ultimate goal (and you can’t have freedom if you have to FORCE people to do your will, can you? got your booster yet?)

    4. How fitting -“… who are consumed by resentful identity politics and who never bother to seek our information that might challenge their assumptions….” you describe yourself to a T. People like me, and millions more like me (at least 74 million;) need to start reclaiming our right to set morals, uphold Nature’s laws and Nature’s God, and not cede the argument to shut up about our Christian values. And only in a country of Freedom can we pursue God’s purpose for our lives and that of our children and children’s children. You totally miss the mark when you discount MAGA and Christianity and the people that sacrifice for this country. I feel sorry for you petey, that you can’t Love your Country, or be grateful for the Love of God. But you have the freedom to be miserable! (but it must be YOUR choice)

  93. NYPete says:

    You keep revealing yourself. Now, not only do you acknowledge that you believe homosexuality is a “perversion against Nature and Nature’s God,” but you challenge President Obama’s American citizenship and his entitlement to associate with “rich white folk.”
    A homophobe and a racial bigot.

    I hope conservatives who might be reading this blog ask themselves if this is really where they want American conservatism to be.

  94. Athos says:

    Wow, petey. You really take the cake, don’t you? So I reveal myself to your magical mystical mind, eh? How wonderful to live in the pretend world of petey! And in one sentence, you hit 6 for 6 and now 7 for 7 in the “nice try, but that’s not what I said, is it?” category! Way to go. I guess when you have to back losers like Joe Brandon and the left’s divorce from reality, all you can do is make stuff up to fit your narrative, huh? Plus when you stuff yourself with such lying news networks (CNN, NBC, CBS, ABC, MSNBC, etc) and propaganda liars in print media (NY Times and WaPo) it must be hard for reality to appear, eh? How’s that Hunter Biden laptop story coming along, anyway?

    And I do believe that any “conservatives who might be reading this blog” or rather, any sane people
    that want to stop teachers from talking to 6 year olds about their sexuality, will gladly join in the fight to reclaim and proclaim our values!

    How you can hope to defend this perversion is beyond me, petey. And you absolutely refuse to let it go, don’t you? What is it with your new Democrat party and pedophilia?

    PS. When you mention “revealing yourself” Jeffrey Toobin comes to mind! He’s one of your guys, isn’t he?

  95. NYPete says:

    1. Do you believe that gay and lesbian Americans should be permitted to marry people of their own gender?
    2. Was President Obama born in the United States?

  96. Athos says:

    1. Do you support classroom instruction by school personnel or third parties on sexual orientation or gender identity in kindergarten through grade 3?

    2. Name Barry Obama’s 3 most significant pieces of legislation he authored prior to being elected President. Bonus – what is the racial make-up of Martha’s Vineyard?

  97. NYPete says:

    Wow — Brandon really hit it out of the park this month — unemployment down to 3.6%, almost half a million jobs created in just one month, hourly wages up. “[T]he most rapid labor market rebound on record.”

  98. Hourly wages up 5.6 percent in March year over year. Inflation up 6.4 percent in February.

  99. NYPete says:

    Seems a little easier to fill up the tank when you have a job than when you don’t. Plus, fastest rate of job creation over a comparable period of any Presidency.

  100. Biden boasted: “Over the course of my presidency, our recovery has now created 7.9 million jobs — more jobs created over the first 14 months of any presidency in any term ever.”

    But 9.6 million jobs were lost due to the pandemic.

    Still have a long way to go to get back to where we were. The civilian workforce participation rate is now 62.4 percent. it was 63.4 percent in January 2020 and 66.6 percent in March 2002.

    https://www.bls.gov/charts/employment-situation/civilian-labor-force-participation-rate.htm

  101. Anonymous says:

    The COVID-19 pandemic and ensuing lockdowns led to job losses in every region, but wide-ranging furlough schemes in the EU, paying up to 90% of salaries, helped the bloc keep more people employed than in the U.S.

    Across Europe, many countries pushed job retention schemes providing wages to employees through company payrolls, compared with the U.S. which focused its efforts on stimulus checks and unemployment pay.

    The EU job retention schemes vary by generosity and duration, country by country, but in essence are all designed to mitigate the effects of a sharp, temporary drop in demand.

    As a result of these job protections, only 2.6 million Europeans lost their jobs in the first three quarters of 2020. In stark contrast, around 9.6 million U.S. workers lost their jobs in the same period, according to Pew Research Center analysis of U.S. government and Eurostat data.

    https://fortune.com/2021/04/20/pandemic-europes-employers-kept-workers-americas-did-not/

  102. Anonymous says:

    And while I’m here Thomas I have a question for you if you have time:

    What impact does rising inflation in Europe (which hopefully can’t be blamed on the US president) have on any narrative blaming US inflation on President Biden? I mean, recent data shows that European inflation is even higher than the inflation rate in the US so isn’t it more reasonable to conclude that factors outside President Biden’s control or influence are responsible for rising inflation across the globe than the reverse?

    “Euro zone inflation hits another record high of 7.5% as Russia-Ukraine war pushes up energy prices”

    https://www.cnbc.com/2022/04/01/euro-zone-inflation-march-2022-ecb-policy.html

  103. Athos says:

    Rising gas prices are in sync with Brandon’s stated goal of ending fossil fuel. (Sept. 6, 2019; Feb. 8, 2020) So why is anyone surprised that gas prices have steadily risen as soon as Brandon was sworn in? Of course, the MSM is running its best disinformation campaign, so the rubes won’t think about it logically (or even realistically).

    And you fellas still have trouble with simple math (maybe it’s the big numbers, huh?) as to Brandon’s Wonderful World of Job Creation, huh? 9.6 million subtract 7.9 million leaves a gap of 1.7million jobs to go!

    AND I’ll bet you were tickled pink about the National Transgender Day of Visibility and our illustrious President promoting child mutilation, weren’t you? That’s got to resonate with X% Americans. (hope you got some picks of the Trans’ Flag flying over the HHH building. I’m sure Hubert was scratching his head about that one, huh?)

    We-e-e-e-elll, I’m here to tell you, anny and petey, that you all have me puzzled about how you keep doubling down on the insanity that attracts MAYBE 20 to 30% of our country’s citizens. Instead of opening up oil exploration (to make us energy independent once again) Brandon’s handlers are releasing 1 million barrels of oil from our reserves per day for the next 6 months (right up to the ’22 elections, huh? Imagine that!) It’s almost like you have some way of rigging the election box so you’re not worried about persuading anyone of the wonderful job you’re doing…….

    Nah!

    Next I’ll be thinking that the reason our next Supreme can’t give a definition of “what a woman is” or “when does life begin” is because what she really believes is abhorrent to a major majority of Americans. So it’s just easier to say “I don’t recall”

    Hmmm…

  104. Athos says:

    Dog gone that spell check! It’s “pics” not picks of that glorious old TG flag! Wonder if you guys are working on an anthem?

    PS Tom, we now hit 105 comments for this topic!

  105. I recently read Elizabeth George’s latest novel, “Something to Hide.” The hidden thing is FGM (female genital mutilation) practiced by some African immigrants. Is that now OK?

  106. Anonymous says:

    So, US inflation is up 6.4% but US based corporate profits are up more than 25%. In fact, during 2021, corporate profits have risen higher than profits in more than 70 years.

    “Food companies in particular blamed pandemic disruptions, inflation and strong consumer demand for higher prices, with pork and beef up 14% and 20%, respectively, versus a year ago. Those prices, in turn, have often fueled a jump in earnings. Tyson Foods, the nation’s biggest meat processor, posted more than $1 billion in profit in the first quarter of 2022, up 48% from the year-earlier period.”

    I wonder which one is driving which one (but not really) and why it makes more sense to blame the president for inflation, than it does to blame the corporations whose products make up the constituents of the bread basket of inflation measures?

    From the corporations perspective what a great thing is is for the poor ignorant masses to believe that rather than the corporations greed and rape of the American people, that it is instead a guy republicans say hasn’t done anything in his more than 40 year career as a politician.

    “I love my uneducated voters”

    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/inflation-corporate-profits-record/

  107. Athos says:

    And so all we do is talk across one another. Because that’s all you lefties can do. Clutch at straws and ignore outrageous barbarities. You don’t want a discussion about values and/or the obvious train wreck that is Joe Biden. You point to BS reasons that “try” to excuse Brandon’s gross negligence. And Kammy’s wonderful oratory skills!

    This is the time you should be very worried, Anny. The people are waking up and not believing the lying MSM. Or are you ready to pull off your “Biden miracle 2AM vote dump” again?

  108. Athos says:

    “It isn’t so much that liberals are ignorant. It’s just that they know so many things that aren’t so.” ― Ronald Reagan

  109. Inflation is not caused by the price of goods going up but by the value of money going down.

  110. Anonymous says:

    “Inflation is the increase in the price of goods and services over time. Inflation causes your buying power to erode, meaning that the same dollar today buys less in the future. “The simple story is too much money chasing too few goods and services,” says Dean Baker, senior economist at the Center for Economic and Policy Research.”

    https://www.businessinsider.com/causes-of-inflation

  111. Anonymous says:

    “What is a simple definition of inflation?
    Inflation is the rate of increase in prices over a given period of time. Inflation is typically a broad measure, such as the overall increase in prices or the increase in the cost of living in a country.”

    https://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/fandd/basics/30-inflation.htm

    And from the Oxford Dictionary

    in·fla·tion
    /inˈflāSH(ə)n/

    2.
    ECONOMICS
    a general increase in prices and fall in the purchasing value of money.

    https://languages.oup.com/google-dictionary-en

  112. Rincon says:

    Wow, I can’t believe you guys are still going at it! My congrats on your endurance!

    I don’t have much to contribute at the moment, but I notice Anon’s question went unanswered. If the Democrats are responsible for all of today’s inflation, then how do you explain that today’s inflation rate is rising world wide? Are you postulating that the actions of other countries and the behavior of billions of individuals around the world influence nothing? That only the President of the United States and a do nothing Congress hold a rudder which steers the entire world economy all by itself? And that the actions of oil producers have no effect on the price of oil? Only the President and Congress?

  113. Athos says:

    A little trivia nostalgic treat (and I think apropos!) How much money (euros) do you think they’ve been pumping into the EU Market fellas? Hint: at one time Mario Draghy was putting in 60 billion EU PER MONTH (at the same time we were putting Trillion$ into our market) And I don’t believe the new girl, Christine Lagarde, is doing any different.

    But that’s all a distraction from the filth that you leftist are trying to ram down the gullet of the American People. It’s not working, fellas. It’s funny that whenever Republicans don’t make good on their promises, they get voted out of office! But with Democrats, you fellas get shellacked when you DO make good on your promises.

    Europe, and I’m pretty sure the US will follow, have woken up and tossed out the Green Dream for some good old fashion coal, gas, and oil. Reality has that affect on people.

  114. NYPete says:

    You are the guy who doesn’t think gay Americans should have the right to marry, who thinks that President Obama wasn’t born in America, and who thinks there was a vast, unfathomable conspiracy to steal the 2020 election in dozens of states.

  115. Athos says:

    OK, Groomer! I’m still waiting for Zero’s accomplishments prior to being Prez. You need some help looking up his time in the Illinois Senate? Or his time as a US Senator?

    Inquiring minds want to know, petey!

  116. Athos says:

    And with the NY times (which used to be a newspaper) suppressing the Hunter Biden Laptop story (along with Twitter, Facebook and all the MSM with the exception of Fox news), I don’t think there’s much doubt that there was a very “fathomable” conspiracy to steal the 2020 election. There are credible reports coming out NOW about improper vote tallies in several key states that Biden won.

    But don’t look to hard for the DOJ to do anything about it. Imagine that! Truth is, you’ve gone too far with this desire to groom children as young as 5 into this sick, twisted evil child mutilation, and people are finally waking up to just how vile you are. I have (and have stated) a theological reason for what marriage is. That is my opinion and you can’t tell me to shut up, especially given how depraved and godless and anti-American you’ve become.

    And don’t look now, petey, but more and more Americans are reaching this conclusion, also. Truth and reality are starting to push back against your woke ideology, and my money is on Truth.

    What sort of world do YOU want to live in, petey?

  117. NYPete says:

    So you don’t deny it. You proudly reaffirm it, and add in some homophobic insanity about genital mutilation and “grooming.”
    “Athos” is what conservatism has become.

  118. NYPete says:

    In fairness, however, a good case can be made that “Athos” is what American conservatism has always been.

  119. Anonymous says:

    Fairness is a positive attribute so kudos to you Pete.

  120. Athos says:

    1)”A new law recently passed in California allows children as young as 12 years old to receive taxpayer-funded transgender treatments and services, without parental consent.”(9/2018)

    2)A similar law was passed in Washington in January forcing insurance coverage for gender dysmorphia treatment and gender-affirming care for minors between 13 and 17, without parent consent……

    Where do you find the “homophobic insanity” in that, petey?

    You are attacking normalcy, and you are attacking the very fiber of our traditions. And you are attacking Freedom! For what purpose, petey? (fair minded anny can jump in there, too!) One can argue that you are attacking REALITY. You and your ilk are trying to validate the abnormal, and the only way you can do it, is to shut down any dissent (like the fascists you are!)

    We are not a racist nation. CRT should not be taught as history.

    Police are not racist and singling out black live to kill. (the actual numbers are less than a rounding error)

    George Floyd was a drug addict felon that robbed pregnant women at the point of a gun, passed a phony $20 bill, resisted arrest, died with 3 times the lethal dose of fentanyl in his system which would hardly qualify him for sainthood.

    Classroom discussion about sexual orientation or gender identity in grades K thru 3 is perverted.

    Joe Biden needs to take the Montreal Cognitive Assessment (it only takes 10 minutes) immediately with the results posted nationwide, because he’s not working with a full deck AND HE HAS THE CODES!! (funny how the Donald never fired one off, eh?)

    People are waking up to your evil ways, boys! ………..And what are you gonna do now that Elon Musk has bought into Twitter?

  121. I did not realize Washington state had done that, too. I always wondered what would have happened had they put Floyd in the back of the patrol immediately. Would the drugs have killed him anyway?

  122. Anonymous says:

    Republicans were right again; more electoral fraud discovered in America, I wonder if Trump’s encouragement for his people to vote twice was at the heart of this?

    “CONCORD, N.H. (AP) — A former Trump administration official now running for Congress in New Hampshire voted twice during the 2016 primary election season, potentially violating federal voting law and leaving him at odds with the Republican Party’s intense focus on “election integrity.”

    https://thehill.com/news/wire/3259214-trump-aide-seeking-nh-house-seat-voted-in-2-states-in-2016/

  123. Anonymous says:

    Do you figure “the president told me to do it” counts as a defense to election fraud”?

    “Trump encourages supporters to try to vote twice, sparking uproar”

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-trump-vote/trump-encourages-supporters-to-try-to-vote-twice-sparking-uproar-idUSKBN25U0KK

  124. Athos says:

    Anny, do you have any idea how ridiculous you look reaching at straws? How can you ignore the Hunter Biden laptop story being squashed and not see the damage done? What you posted is laughable (and quite childish & petty) but then again, those descriptors fit your political ideology, don’t they?

    Actually, Tom, I wonder if there would have been any kind of fuss at all had it not been an election year. Or if the “shut down for 15 days to slow the spread” would have only lasted 15 days (as it should have)

    Hindsight is always 50/50, but we did have active players with their 1st mission NOT to protect America from the WuHan Flu, but to defeat Donald Trump in the November election. They got what they wanted and now we’re stuck with this dangerous clown show administration.

  125. Anonymous says:

    Athos, you’re a child who should, at most, be seen not heard.

    Tragically, you continue to spew your digital pollution out to the world; if only there was some way to stop that in the same way that the “governor” of Florida is trying to stop discussions from happening among teachers and their students.

  126. NYPete says:

    Very naive of me to assume that a former journalist like Thomas Mitchell would first make an effort to check out a provocative factual assertion before spreading it further — such as the garbage assertion that George Floyd would have died anyway of a drug overdose.

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2021/04/16/fact-check-fentanyl-george-floyd-not-enough-to-cause-death/7239448002/

    Then again, I see he also descending into spreading gross QAnon lunacy about vulnerable teenagers.

  127. Yes, an expert said he died of a lack of oxygen, but what if he’d been put in the patrol car with that much fentanyl in his system?

  128. NYPete says:

    1. No experts (and there were several of them) said that George Floyd would have died from fentanyl if he had not had a police officer’s knee on his neck for nine minutes. And saying he simply died from a “lack of oxygen,” is pretty rich, isn’t it?
    2. It is perfectly OK for you to have a Murray Rothbard-type ultra-libertarianism. I don’t like it, I don’t agree with it, but it is an understandable sort of world-view. But just because you often find yourself aligned with terrible people like Trump and “Athos,” please don’t even flirt with the disgusting trend of going after LGBTQ teenagers. It is disgraceful. What would Ralston say?

  129. Athos says:

    Anny, you really should stop openly displaying those fascist tendencies by wanting to stop freedom of speech.(Soros will stop paying you!!) And just for your edification, school is NOT an open society where teachers, drag queen story hour people, and councillors are allowed to indoctrinate and “groom” young impressionable minds (5 years old, anny? really?? 5 year olds???) against the wishes of their parents or guardians. Have you NO shame??

    petey to the journalistic rescue!! Tell us the story about the mostly peaceful protests, again, will ya, petey?? There was no way that justice system was going to find that verdict any other way but fairy tale city, fellas. They DID NOT want their city to burn to the ground again. ( they did a job on downtown Minny, didn’t they? $500 million worth!! Bet they ALL wished they dumped that dude into the back of the squad car!)

    Did they ever build it all back (better)?

  130. NYPete says:

    So, in addition to believing that gay Americans shouldn’t have the right to marry, that President Obama wasn’t born in America, and that there was a vast, unfathomable conspiracy to steal the 2020 election in dozens of states, “Athos” also believes that the officer who knelt on George Floyd’s neck for nine minutes wasn’t guilty.

    “Athos” is what conservatism has become.

  131. Anonymous says:

    “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”

    Teachers and students lose their First Amendment Rights when they walk through the public school house doors.
    -“Gov” Desantis

    What do you think about this new law Thomas?

  132. An “employee” is not free to speak whatever he or she wishes. Talking about students in K-3 about certain sexual matters can be limited by the “employer.”

  133. Anonymous says:

    So then government employees do not have freedom of speech so long as the “employer”; i.e. the government limits it?

    And I’m wondering which part of the First Amendment you rely on for that claim?

  134. The employee is free to speak outside the workplace, but, if the employee speaks outside established bounds at work, the employer is free to fire them.

  135. Anonymous says:

    I appreciate that and I understand what you’re saying and the only question I have is where, in the language of the First Amendment you find support for that?

    And I know that you have been somewhat absolutist and literal with regard to the language of the Constitution in the past so it does seem odd that you deviating here. Unless I’m missing something anyway.

  136. “Congress shall make no law …”

  137. Yes, the 14th says: “No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States …” Still, employees can be instructed in how they do their jobs.

  138. Anonymous says:

    Well you say that and the only thing I’m asking is where you get the support for denying First Amendment Rights to government workers from within the Constitution when it expressly prohibits that denial?

  139. Athos says:

    Bogus argument, Anny. Your values stink, and pretending to stand behind the 1st Amendment rings shallow and false, and quite capricious.(Hunter Biden’s laptop and the “Big Guy” ring a bell?) You still have not told us why you attack normalcy or to put it straight at you, why do you want children under the age of 8 to be exposed to chemical castration?

    And since you (or petey) won’t answer, I’m beginning to think your values are anti-creation and anti-common sense! Next you’ll be telling us that the Civil Rights Act of ’64 doesn’t include the white race! (So go ahead and teach CRT and discriminate against someone because of the color of his skin!)

    petey, why do you continue to post lies about me? Is that really the only argument you have? Or is the English language beyond your ability to comprehend? Are you so perverse that reason has deserted you? Do you think maybe Nature’s God has blinded you to your own wickedness?

    Seek help. Or provide answers to why children 8 and under should be exposed racism and sexual content as opposed to learning how to read. And stop hating on America!

  140. Athos says:

    “And stop hating on America!” It’s unseemly! Haven’t you learned from Zman and the Ukraine that Patriotism, and Manhood are back in fashion??

  141. NYPete says:

    So you actually do believe that gay Americans have the right to marry, that President Obama was born in the United States, that the 2020 election wasn’t stolen by little green men and that the police officer who knelt on George Floyd’s neck was indeed guilty? That would indeed be progress.

  142. Rinc says:

    Wow, still going!

    I think Pete has a point, but not perhaps the one he seems to be trying to make. The Constitution doesn’t include every possible situation. Case law is an important contributor, as are social mores. It is obvious that neither a business nor a government office can operate normally if they cannot instruct an employee on what to say to the point that in some cases, a script must be followed. They also cannot allow employees to verbally abuse those they serve. The point to Conservatives is that not everything the government is allowed to do is specifically mentioned in the Constitution. If Conservatives cannot accept that, then they should also agree with Pete’s point, unless they can support it Constitutionally.

  143. Rincon says:

    I think Derek Chauvin is guilty of negligent homicide, not murder. It was clearly against his own self interest to murder someone while being recorded. One medical fact never discussed is that opiates inhibit respiration to the point that this inhibition is the most common cause of death from them in people with no knee on their necks. My best hypothesis is that Chauvin didn’t believe Floyd’s words because others he had treated similarly were able to breathe. He apparently had no clue that the opiates inhibited Floyds ability to respire. His actions were grossly negligent, but death was likely unintentional.

  144. NYPete says:

    Wow – US jobless claims now at their lowest level since 1968. More good news from the Brandon Administration.

  145. Anonymous says:

    More good news is the first former public defender has been confirmed to the Supreme Court.

    You have to give President Biden a lot of credit for fulfilling yet another campaign promise even if you’d rather not see a black female on the Supreme Court.

  146. Rincon says:

    Good to see the confirmation. Also good that a former public defender and a black woman are finally on the court. The unfortunate thing though, is that Biden’s stating of his intention of submitting an affirmative action nominee sort of cut her legs out from under her. He should never say that he is nominating anyone for either SCOTUS, the vice presidency, or anything else because of their gender or skin color. Just do it and say they’re the best choice for the job.

    By the same token, why does he insist on telling Putin what he will and will not do? A cardinal rule of warfare is to keep your cards close to your chest. For example, instead of saying he won’t send Polish jets to Ukraine because he’s afraid of what Putin might do in response, he could have easily said that the more modern Russian fighters are capable of quickly dispatching the Polish ones, and that the logistics of supplying adequate fuel for the Polish fighters are daunting.

  147. Anonymous says:

    Rincon I agree that he should not have broadcast his decision regarding the planes. That was a bad move. But he’s made plenty of good decisions about the war in the Ukraine and taken strong actions to isolate and punish the Russians for their aggression so I will write it off to; you can’t be right 100% of the time.

    And when Biden made his promise he was fighting for his political life and one very important demographic (largely undecided at the time) were young, black, women and so his move while in hindsight seems a mistake, actually was smart and he did win the votes of those young black women which very well could have turned the tide for him.

  148. Athos says:

    Ah, tweedle dee and tweedle dumb. You two make beautiful music together. A little nauseating, but when you have to support such an obvious doddering, confused and corrupt old man, what else can you two do?
    So you’re proud as punch to have a Supreme Court Justice that a) can’t define what a woman is (good luck with any Title IX decisions) b)has no idea “when human life begins” (good luck with Roe V Wade cases) and c) gives lighter sentences to pedophiles (is she a Soros puppet?).

    And neither of you fellows care to weigh in on why you’re so bent on having young children groomed for mutilation. Cat got your tongue? You’re so good at trying to read my mind (utter fail by the way) that you can’t speak your own?

    I believe that when history is revisited to this time period, people will be revolted by the monstrosity you fellas are pushing. Instead of spending money and time on trying to help these poor confused, misguided souls, you are pushing to make them accepted as normal (to their destruction and undoing!) Nothing could be further from the truth, boys. You are offending creation, and offending common sense and decency.

    Shame on you!

    As to Putin and Brandon, how stupid do you have to be to buy into the Green New Deal? Don’t you realize that Russian disinformation is spending million$ to promote anti fracking policies? I wonder who that benefits ??(hint: Putin!)Check out the group “Sea Change” if you don’t (or won’t) believe me. Biden is a pathetical liar carrying on long career of pathetic lies that have enriched him and his family at America’s expense.

    and he’s your bright and shiny star, isn’t he?

  149. Anonymous says:

    “As Bloomberg put it: Mr. Trump “became the first American president to push for higher oil prices in more than 30 years.”

  150. Athos says:

    What? No Bloomburger articles on gender affirming surgery for 9 year olds? You know they’re out there! Jen Psack it to me said so in her presentation today!

    Quoting Wapo or the old grey lady just fully reveals the depths of your depravity. Why would any sane person (or any person with self respect) believe a thing either of these former papers print?

    They lie. Just like Zero lied about ZeroCare. Just like Fauci lied about Wuhan. Just like Joe Biden lied about Hunter’s laptop. And lied about not walking anything back. And lies about Trump’s ties to Russia. And lies about inflation being transitory. And gas increase isn’t due to Biden’s call for no more drilling (campaign promise) but is due to Putin’s war. Lies about our wonderfully successful exit from Afghanistan. And parents are terrorist at school board meetings. And the border is under control. And gender is fluid. And abortion isn’t murder. And so on, and so on, and scooby dooby dooby!

    And you fellas have gotten pretty good at lying yourselves! That’s just a sign that you are really, really desperate, isn’t it? We can’t trust MSM. We can’t trust the talking heads on the TV. And we certainly can’t trust our vaunted former news papers.

    What are we gonna do? A little help here, Thomas! Can the printed word regain its respect? Is there anyone willing to admit they made a mistake or is shame banished from the land??

  151. Anonymous says:

    ha ha

    Final tally of lies: Analysts say Trump told 30,000 mistruths – that’s 21 a day – during presidency

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-election-2020/trump-lies-false-presidency-b1790285.html

  152. Athos says:

    Ohio anny, you really exemplify true leftist idiocy! Didn’t read the two comments to your cited piece, did you? Actually, I couldn’t have said it better myself! To save you the effort of going to that webpage again, here it is:

    From ValueCre8or,

    “This is laughable. Imagine how politically corrupt you must be to believe that Trump lied that often, let alone publish it. The corruption by the establishment bureaucrats who relentlessly attack Trump is the biggest threat to the planet. On the big issues, Trump had a much better record than the American socialists and the globalists. He embarrassed them, and they hated him for that.”

    So, just how “politically corrupt” are you, anny?

    I may not see it in my lifetime, but God fearing people will take the Culture back, one small victory at a time…starting with ending this vicious attack on our children’s sexuality. Pervert is as pervert does, fellas! Mamma Bear is NOT gonna let you “groom” her kids!

    Psst. bridge too far!

  153. Anonymous says:

    “I love the poorly educated!”

  154. Athos says:

    It’s good (although a bit narcissistic) to love yourself, anny! To quote a truly great man, “It’s not that liberals aren’t smart, it’s just that so much of what they know isn’t so…..”

    I’ll take the common sense of a God fearing man over the most educated pompous elite, any day.

  155. Anonymous says:

    Leave it to one of Trump’s uneducated voters to quote an uneducated president, for some proposition that makes him feel better while he then talks about someone else’s narcissism.

    Take the plank out of your eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.

  156. Athos says:

    Oh anny, how far you have fallen that you must quote from that dreaded Book! Did you burn your fingers rifling the pages in search of Jesus’ quote?

    And have you ever asked yourself why your ilk can’t stand one of America’s most beloved Presidents? It must be quite scary being perched on such a high pinnacle. Anything to deflect from your twisted desire to groom our children for perversion.

    You really don’t have to be like this. And this is the week to ponder, reflect, repent and accept the gift that was paid for you at a terrible price!

  157. NYPete says:

    Fascinating to see Republicans like Athos move into QAnon territory.

  158. Anonymous says:

    Most popular US Presidents ranked:

    “Have you ever asked yourself why your ilk can’t stand one of America’s most beloved Presidents”?

    8. Barrack Hussain Obama
    9. Ronald Wilson Reagan

    https://today.yougov.com/topics/politics/articles-reports/2021/07/27/most-and-least-popular-us-presidents-according-ame

  159. Anonymous says:

    Most popular US presidents ranked

    9. Barrack Hussain Obama
    10. Jimmy Carter
    14. Ronald Wilson Reagan

    “…have you ever asked yourself why your ilk can’t stand one of America’s most beloved Presidents?”

    https://today.yougov.com/ratings/politics/popularity/US-presidents/all

  160. Athos says:

    petey, there you are! Ready to answer why it’s so imperative for you to teach children from Pre-K through 3rd grade about gender and sexual identity, when you aren’t their parent or guardian? Anytime……we’ll just wait right here……

    https://stacker.com/stories/747/experts-rank-best-us-presidents-all-time

    #8 JFK
    #9 Ron Reagan
    #10 LBJ
    #11 Woodrow Wilson
    #12 Barry O

    There’s all kind of lists, anny, (and printing it twice doesn’t make it doubly so)

  161. Athos says:

    I would strongly discount ANY list that has Jimmy Carter at #10…… don’t you think??

  162. Anonymous says:

    Athos lists most recent ranking (2021)

    Barack Hussain Obama moves up 2 to number 10
    Ronny Raygun remains the same at number 9

    The Orange Stain of Humanity enters the list at #41 (out of 44)

    So there’s that….

    https://www.c-span.org/presidentsurvey2021/?page=overall

  163. Athos says:

    So what about all your recent Bible readings, anny? Wanna share a few more scriptures with us? Or are you too ashamed to admit Reagan was more beloved than Barry O?

    Here’s a little clue for you, anny. Reagan LOVED America (as does Donald Trump). I don’t believe I’ve ever heard anyone say that about Barry Zero.

    Can you?

    And hey, petey! Where’s your explanation about what’s wrong with parents wanting control over their 8 year olds sex education?? Try to be honest and tell us, OK?

    Oh, and when is your gov going to let 5 year olds take off their mask in school?

  164. NYPete says:

    You really do have a thing about little kids and sex, don’t you?

  165. Anonymous says:

    Athos lists’ most recent ranking (2021)

    10. Barack Hussain Obama




    41. (tie) Orange Stain on Humanity

  166. Athos says:

    What’s the matter, petey? First you can’t validate why the Florida Parents Rights Law is wrong (actually, you won’t even proffer one reason!), and then you project the new Democrat party’s perversion on to ……Me??? Actually, when it comes to preserving the innocence of childhood, I definitely take a stand. Seems all the perverts on your side of the aisle, petey. How come?

    How precious is that? You and your ilk have gone too far. Why is the left the party of pedophilia? And you have that senile old grifting hair sniffer as the standard bearer of your party! Makes you proud as punch, listening to him try to speak, huh?

    Anny, why are you repeating yourself? Run out of clever things to say? (OK, enter it again a few more times, maybe somebody will believe you!)

    Are you still hurting over the post with the anti left (and conversely, reality based) comments that you put out there April 9, 10:18am? Why don’t you try admitting you messed up?

  167. NYPete says:

    There it is: full-on QAnon insanity – Democrats are perverts and “the party of pedophilia.”
    That is what Republicans like Athose now believe.

  168. Anonymous says:

    The great opiate of todays right wing; that facts don’t exist and the only thing that matters is whether you believe or not.

    “The Orange Stain wasn’t really ranked 41st among the 44 presidents ranked by CSPAN because I don’t believe it”.

    “I love my uneducated voters”

  169. Athos says:

    Anny, you taking up petey’s nasty habit of lying about what I say? And just when are you or petey gonna tell us all about why teachers need to groom 6 year olds about gender fluidity? I’ve heard that your new term for the Florida bill is “Wait until they’re Eight!” You lefties are so good about turning a phrase, aren’t you?

    And talk about ignoring facts, could you possibly point out where in the Florida bill are the words “Don’t say gay”? The Democrat party HAS been taken over by the far left loons that won’t renounce mutilation surgery on children. And that POS Becerra (HHS secretary) would rather take children from their parents to get “gender-affirming care” with our tax dollars, (more wards of the state) than address the absolute destruction of Democrat run inner cities! Ridden the subway, lately, petey?

    https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/boebert-grills-hhs-secretary-becerra-on-trans-teens-and-tax-dollars-in-fiery-letter

    So yea, petey. There’s nothing “QAnon” about it. Your group, Brandon and the Democrats, are full out perverts that want to destroy the American family, and the traditional American way of life. But at least you’ve brought it out into the open, and the push back you get is richly deserved.

    And one more thing for this evening. Conservative, Christian, man/woman married w/ 2 children, working, responsible Americans have been under attack for the last 50 years, and it took Donald Trump to show us how to fight. So you can have your “orange stain” laugh for now, but when we kick your perverted, value depleted, failed philosophy to the curb, I believe the Donald will rate quite high in the Presidents list.

    Just saying……

  170. NYPete says:

    Took the New York City subway just the other day. Hell of a lot safer than driving. And fewer carbon emissions.

  171. If you don’t get shot or smoke bombed.

  172. NYPete says:

    I bet you feel safe driving, unless, of course you are one of the 38,000 people who die in America every year in car accidents. That is 12.4 deaths for every 100,000 US residents. In contrast, on the NYC subways the number of felonies — not fatalities, felonies — is about 2 for every million riders. I’ll take those odds.

  173. Athos says:

    You’re whistling thru the graveyard, petey. Your party has bought full into the lunacy that no American citizen (and darn few illegals) will agree. And in your smug arrogance to make fun of the 10 people shot and 29 total injuries in the NY subway just 3 days ago, you totally don’t give a hoot about the suffering of ordinary human beings. Says a lot about your humanity (and lack thereof), doesn’t it?

    It boggles my mind that something that was totally off the radar 10 years ago is now being affirmed by the press secretary of the President of the US! She is promoting gender affirming health care for children! And Brandon’s DOJ is going to go after states that won’t mutilate (gender reassignment surgery) CHILDREN.

    https://www.myheraldreview.com/news/state/doj-warning-targets-az-gender-surgery-law-for-youths/article_f1513d84-b1f6-11ec-b4e0-37a3b625be0f.html/?utm_medium=internal&utm_source=readerShare&utm_campaign=bButton

    So, good luck with that one, fellas. Your deviant, failed ideology needs to be soundly defeated. Because it’s pure evil. Have a reflective Good Friday!

  174. Anonymous says:

    I’m old enough to remember when gay rights were off the radar and now

    “Trump says he loves playing ‘gay national anthem’ and show tunes when he DJs at Mar-a-Lago”

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-gay-national-anthem-ymca-b2033188.html

    Course, I’m also old enough to remember the far right wing trotting out “flag burning” every election day so as to rally their…followers who argued repeatedly about desecrating and disrespecting our flag was near treasonous.

    Whatever happened to them?

  175. Anonymous says:

    I’m on my 3rd cup of coffee now and my mind is a whirr but a question popped into my head about the new Florida law censoring discussions among students and others in public schools.

    Question:

    Could a Florida public school teacher tell their students the story of Adam and Eve and particularly the part about Eve being made from Adam’s rib? This seems to be one of those “gender identify” issues that the state “law” would bar from discussion but if it was, wouldn’t this be a violation of all parties “freedom of religion”?

    And we all know how heinous that is in today environment, leastways if you’re a Christian being denied that freedom.

    Finally, would the rabid right wing today label this as “attempted grooming”?

    “Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.”

  176. Athos says:

    Wow. Just when I think you can’t go any lower, Ohio anny, you shock me with an abundance of derision and hypocrisy.

    When was the last time you were in an elementary school, oh righteous one? Because the story of Adam and Eve being taught in public schools was before MY time in short pants!

    And for the proper verse, check out Matthew 18:6….. “but whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to stumble, it would be better for him to have a heavy millstone hung around his neck, and to be drowned in the depth of the sea.” (that’s coming from He that died for you and me, anny. We’re celebrating his ascension from the depths of Hades, tomorrow – Easter!)

    And just so we’re on the same page, I’m happy that’s homosexuals aren’t arrested and thrown in jail for being homosexual, like they were prior to the 1967 Sexual Offenses Act. And to reiterate my position, homosexuality is an abnormal lifestyle. As human beings, we are designed to propagate the race by having children. And the best way to raise a child is in a nuclear family ..Father, Mother, children…. making that the normal. It’s the best way proven by the test of time!

    Have fun with that Ohio anny! And for the record, Trump is not a perfect man. But he is a fighter and that is just what the Republican party needed and what the country, needs! Cause what we have now is Brandon……(petey, you still proud of Brandon??)

  177. Anonymous says:

    Matthew 19:14 and 19:15

    Jesus said, “Let the little children come to Me, and do not hinder them! For the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these.” And after He had placed His hands on them,

    I’m assuming the far right wing would really go nuts about the hands thing…

  178. Anonymous says:

    Its funny you that the right wing loves to say that freedom of religion and the establishment clause never meant that religion couldn’t be taught in public schools.

    And the lesson of Adam and Eve is sure ‘nough taught to kids younger than 3rd grade in Sunday School classes (using “gummy snakes” to make the story more interesting for the little tikes) so why would Florida ban schools from even discussing it in public schools? Weird.

    I want my (Christian) Freedom of Religion!

    https://www.childrens-ministry-deals.com/blogs/childrens-pastors-only/how-to-teach-the-story-of-adam-eve-to-kids

  179. Anonymous says:

    In Florida, 1+1=2 is too left wing to allow public school children to learn without censoring.

    “Florida’s education department has rejected 54 mathematics textbooks from next year’s school curriculum, citing alleged references to critical race theory”

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/apr/17/florida-rejects-math-textbooks-critical-race-theory

  180. Athos says:

    Oh anny, you’ve been busy about stuff you know nothing about! (I know that sentence needs an edit, Thomas, but it just rolled off the tongue thru the fingers and onto the page! sorry!)

    Glad you got a chance to read a little scripture! I’ve tried to instruct you in NOT making assumptions, but I guess insulting Jesus Christ and those of us that worship Him, is just another day in the life, right? You’ll get your chance to meet Him someday, Ohio anny, and then you can judge for yourself.

    And I hope you understand that Sunday School is not Public School, OK? I know they both have the word “School” in them and it might confuse you, but we’re here to help you out. (Wow. that was really condescending, wasn’t it? Sorry ’bout that)

    Truth is I do believe the Bible should be taught in Public School. These kids (and it would seem quite a few adults) need to know where these “inalienable rights” are derived and just exactly who is this “Creator” and “Nature’s God” (not to be confused with Gaia!) Maybe that will be the next step in the clean up in Florida ed.

    They haven’t published what books were CRT filled but I can give you an example from a friend of mine in PS math education. They do inject inappropriate racism in the problem solving examples for some of the math equations. After all, CRT and the 1619 project are the very definition of Racism and are illegal thanks to the Civil Rights Act of 1964 (what party was trying to kill the bill with a filibuster, anyway?)

    I don’t think it’s a good idea to make fun of people that want to teach the Adam & Eve story to kids. Gummy worms are silly but not as harmful as Drag Queen Storytime. Of course, that’s just my opinion.

  181. NYPete says:

    Good to know that Athos thinks the Koran and the Bhagavad Gita should be taught in elementary school. Get ’em while they’re young, I say.

  182. Anonymous says:

    Pete how many times does he have to say that this freedom of religion taught in schools goes ONLY for “good” religions like Christianity and…well that’s it for now.

    Geez.

  183. Anonymous says:

    And I’m still left with the question of whether the story of Adam and Eve (with or without gummy snakes from the Garden) could be taught to kids in K-3rd in Florida under their new law of censorship?

    I mean, Eve being made from the rib of Adam sure sounds like a discussion of gender to me but then I’m left with Florida law excluding discussions of religion which the right says is oh so wrong.

  184. Athos says:

    Let me think, petey……. what Muslims and/or Hindus were part of our Founding Fathers? What country in SE Asia or India or Oceania have a Republic to govern them following a Constitution like ours? My point being, the Men that founded our Great Republic and wrote the Declaration of Independence, and our Constitution were of Christian descent. Not trying to start an argument, just stating facts. And for your edification, both Koran and Hinduism ARE being taught in public schools in this country (check out Michigan and Minnesota) and of course, Mormonism in Utah.

    Strange, huh?

    Don’t look now, petey, but your comment about “Get ’em while they’re young” sounds like what’s driving the animus toward Florida’s “wait until eight” bill. Shame on you!

    Anny and petey, how can we debate the merits of the Florida bill if you won’t state why you support it? Is this just a typical leftist ploy? You can’t present and justify your ideas so you have to silence all debate, by force, if necessary? That sounds fascist and totalitarian, to me. What do you call it??

    But I encourage you to keep reading the Bible and possibly a miraculous conversion will occur. I’ve found Luke to be an interesting author. You should start with his Gospel (the one according to Luke) and follow up with the Book of Acts.

    Genesis is a wonderful Book but maybe too hard for you to comprehend. But it does great service to the original bond between God and Man, and of course, God and Abraham. From a literature standpoint, the Bible is a wonderful read. Far better than most of the drivel being foisted on our youth today. And there are so many references to the Bible, that a rudimentary understanding is needed, don’t you think? (I mean, look how you guys hunt and peck out some verses, yes?)

  185. NYPete says:

    Whoa, wait a minute here … so you are saying that the government should teach only the New Testament to little kids in school? Not the Old Testament? Not the Koran? Not the Vedas? Not the Guru Granth Sahib or the Dao De Jing? Interesting notion of the First Amendment you’ve got there.
    Well, I’ll tell you what: If, as you contend, little kids in school should be indoctrinated with the religious ideas of the 18th Century founding generation, I would settle — however reluctantly — for teaching them from the Jefferson Bible.
    That seems like a reasonable compromise.

  186. Athos says:

    petey, you’re such an obvious and disingenuous tool. Why you continue to TRY to distort and lie about what others say is such a juvenile way to live! You’re not still in Middle School, are you? I’m I actually debating a 12 year old?

    And it’s obvious that you haven’t begun to read the Gospel of Luke. When you grow up, petey, you’ll really need to take care of your soul. It’s a shame that I’m the one that has to tell you this, but God does work in mysterious ways.

    Oh, and thankfully no more masks on flights in the US. Hoo-ray for grownups stepping in!!

  187. NYPete says:

    Well, help me out here. Do you want to teach kids in public school the Christian Bible only? Or do you want to also teach them religious ideas from the Koran, the Talmud, the Great Scroll of Wicca, and other religious documents? Seems like an easy question to answer.

  188. Athos says:

    Why don’t you spell out your objections to the Parental Rights in Education bill for Florida, and then we can discuss what Morals are needed to teach to our children.

    I eagerly await your explanation, petey. Not only should it be an easy question to answer, it’s also germane to the topic du jour! (you wouldn’t want us getting out in the weeds, right?)

  189. NYPete says:

    The Don’t Say Gay Law uses intentionally vague language to outlaw (or, at the very least, to severely chill) any kind of references to LGBTQ people, families, and issues, from kindergarten through 12th grade. HB 1557 specifically states: “Classroom instruction by school personnel or third parties on sexual orientation or gender identity may not occur in kindergarten through grade 3 or in a manner that is not age appropriate or developmentally appropriate for students in accordance with state standards.” That means that for grades 4-12 there is a partial ban, depending on so-called “state standards,” which are left undefined. For grades K-3 one cannot even mention the fact that one has a gay family without risking a violation of the law. And note that the text of the law says nothing about teaching children or teenagers about sexual acts. It prohibits a female teacher from mentioning that she has a wife, or from reading from a book that includes depictions of same-sex families. That the law was intended to prohibit anyone associated with a school from mentioning the reality of being gay and that it has little if anything to do with specific instruction about sex is made clear by the fact that when the Democrats tried to amend the law to replace the current text with a ban on discussion of “sexual activity,” Republicans defeated the amendment.
    As for enforcement, any parent anywhere in Florida can sue a school district if a teacher assigns a book that portrays LGBTQ characters in a positive light. The school faces punishing financial damages, the teacher faces termination — destruction of her career.

    Those are only some of the problems with the Don’t Say Gay law.

    Now — answer my question: Which religious texts and doctrines should children in public schools be indoctrinated with — just Christian, or do you think public schools should teach the Koran and the Torah as well? And, if only Christian, is the indoctrination limited to one branch of Christianity — could a public school teach only Roman Catholic theology, or must it include Protestantism as well?

  190. Athos says:

    Interesting take on why you oppose this “Parental Rights in Education” Bill. I believe you are mistaken about the intent of this bill, and here’s why …… Children start out as concrete thinkers and gradually (7 to 11 years old?) begin to think in the abstract. That’s why young children believe in Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny and believe you if you tell them “you have their nose” (ask a parent friend if you don’t know the “nose trick”) It is destruction of innocence and absolutely NOT the job of a teacher or school counselor to tell a 6 year old that they “may have the body of a boy but could be a girl and that’s ok”. These are impressionable children that need to be taught reading writing and arithmetic, which is the teachers’ actual job, isn’t it?

    And the Biden administration has released a series of documents encouraging gender-reassignment surgery and hormone treatments for minors. This is a horrible wrong that is not easily corrected (if not permanent) and a decision that should never be made by a child.

    How is it that for hundreds of years (in this country) this was unheard of by a vast majority of US citizens? And now it’s some kind of rage that’s sweeping our youth? Could it be somebody is putting a bug in their ear at an early age and keeping it from the parents? (OK, Groomer, you’re busted!)

    Once again, this is abnormal. The normal for any mother and father is for their children to marry and reproduce to continue our species. And Biden now wants to neuter our children?

    For what end, pray tell?

    Abortion isn’t getting the job of depopulating our planet done, fast enough??

    All your arguments have only the teachers in mind, petey. Surely you see that, right? And some of the books that portray LGBQ as positive are pornographic, (“Gender Queer” and”Lawn Boy” both pulled from school libraries, come to mind) The vast majority of parents have only the best interest of their children first and foremost. And I would include the vast majority of teachers have no desire to instruct their students in sexual orientation or gender identity! They are still trying to potty train and teach how to tie their shoelaces!!

    And it is my belief that this sleeping giant you have awakened, will restore us on a much more sane path.

    For a better look, here’s the trailer for the movie, “Who’s Children Are They?”
    https://video.search.yahoo.com/yhs/search?fr=yhs-iry-fullyhosted_011&ei=UTF-8&hsimp=yhs-fullyhosted_011&hspart=iry&param1=yhsbeacon&param2=f%3D4%26b%3DSafari%26cc%3DUS%26pa%3Dmcyahoo%26cd%3D2XzuyEtN2Y1L1QzutDyCzz1R1TtA1O1Pzz1O1P1PyE1O1QyD1O1Tzy1PyD1RtAtCyE1SyB1RtDyEyEtAtD1OyB1TzztD1OzytN1L1G1B1V1N2Y1L1Qzu2StCyE0F0FtCyC0BzytGtDzz0C0CtGyE0F0F0AtGzyyD0FyEtGyDtDtC0D0C0BtCyEyEyEzz0B2QtN1Q2Zzu0StByCzytBtN1L2XzutAtFyCtFtCtBtFtCtN1L1CzutN1T1IzuyEtN1B2Z1V1T1S1Nzu%26cr%3D531169918%26a%3Dmcx_me3579bdfpyzsegikmoq6vy_19_20_ssg0217&p=who%27s+child+is+it+anyway+movie&type=mcx_me3579bdfpyzsegikmoq6vy_19_20_ssg0217#id=0&vid=41aa8b51058607344d540464eede19c1&action=click

    Or go to the website and watch the documentary for yourself.
    https://whosechildrenarethey.com

    Highly recommend this. And thanks for finally eliciting your argument. You take the side of a minority of teachers while the State of Florida is doing the bidding of Mamma and Papa Bear! And just to be clear, NO ONE has any business “mentioning the reality of being gay” in an elementary school setting as part of a child’s education. That is strictly the parents job.

    Just for the record, you’re not a parent, are you?

  191. Athos says:

    OK, the trailer is a bogus feed. Sorry about that. The website (whose children are they?) is for real.

  192. NYPete says:

    Ok, so your silence now makes it clear: you want to indoctrinate children in public schools with Protestant theology but ban similar instruction in Jewish, Islamic, Hindu or other religious thought.

  193. Athos says:

    Jeez, petey. Will you ever learn to stop lying about people? It’s almost like you don’t want to have discourse and try out your opinions in the common square, and see who you can persuade. That’s really leaning fascist, ole buddy!

  194. Athos says:

    As to indoctrination of children in public schools, I’d say the Wuhan flu epidemic that forced kids to learn on line (and gave parents a chance to see what their kids are being taught) awakened an angry segment of our Republic! (hint: PARENTS!)

    The Florida bill (Parental Rights in Education) was to prevent sexual indoctrination of defenseless toddlers by the freaks straight out of “Libs of Tik Tok”! I stand on pretty firm ground in saying that parents across all spectrums don’t want their kidders instructed by freaks in green hair and face piercings on alternate sexual lifestyles.

    And although I don’t remember the Adam and Eve story being taught in my public school (so many years ago) we were instructed on the “Golden Rule” (the “do onto others as you would have others do onto you”) and I may be misremembering but the 10 Commandments were featured prominently in the Supreme Court! And I see absolutely NO problem teaching that to public school children.

    They need to know who this “Creator” is (according to the Founding Fathers) and the faith evidenced by George Washington as the Commander in Chief of the Continental Army that gave us our Independence. And Abraham Lincoln’s deep faith in God that saw him thru our Civil War.

    If by some chance you can find a significant Muslim, Hindu or other “religious thought” individual that gave us our Freedom, I’d be willing to hear your argument, petey! Unfortunately, your Muslim representatives are stridently anti-American (the one that was married to her brother and pays her current husband $millions from her campaign funds!) And Algore’s Gaia is showing how foolish it is to not utilize our energy potential to its fullest. Maybe YOU don’t mind paying $5+/gal for gas, but the vast majority of us DO. So I would rule out that grifter god.

  195. NYPete says:

    So, when you write that you “do believe the Bible should be taught in Public School” you don’t really mean that they should be taught the Bible, simply that little kids should be taught something, something, something about the “Creator,” of whom I presume you mean the Christian god. But none of the Jesus stuff, right?

    Of course, to you the parental rights of Hindus, Jews, Muslims, Jainists, Buddists, et al not to have their little children indoctrinated in another religion can be trampled on without a second thought. (Not to mention atheist parents.) Or perhaps we ought to adapt the Florida law, and permit atheist parents to sue school districts for teaching the Bible to their children.

  196. Anonymous says:

    This topic is clearly going no where and now that Thomas has attempted to move it away from Pete asking (and also answering question) but getting nothing in return I’m going to recommend a book that I’m sure will interest everyone:)

    Thomas Piketty’s latest “A Brief History of Equality” examines the history of…economic equality and with a very long view determined that humans have indeed moved more toward economic equality that might otherwise be believed.

    He also determined that there was one simple reason for this.

  197. NYPete says:

    Far too complex for Athos.

  198. Anonymous says:

    Imagine if that were the standard for publishing how much money would be saved on building libraries, or even bookshelves for that matter?

  199. Anonymous says:

    Thomas I have a question for you in light of one of the posts you made a while back on this thread.

    I was discussing whether you thought a teacher lost their right to free speech in the classroom because and whether the Florida law barring teachers from saying somethings to their students was unconstitutional and you said

    “Thomas Mitchell says:
    April 6, 2022 at 9:34 am

    An “employee” is not free to speak whatever he or she wishes. ”

    I wonder if your opinion is the same in this instance:

  200. He is free to pray, not to force others to pray.

  201. Athos says:

    There was a time, and not that long ago, when everyone prayed. Remember?

    But that didn’t last too long, did it, fellas? And look at all the unity we have now. Who profits in this upheaval?

    I firmly believe that we will return to those days. And the morals of the Bible would be a welcome breathe of fresh air in a broken public school system, no matter what your religion (or lack their of) would be. You have preyed on the tolerance of us conservatives, and we have ceded the proper argument thinking you’d never want to drag us into your pit of depravity.

    But your grooming of our children, has united nearly all parents and once awakened, hopefully, we won’t go back to sleep.

    As to Piketty, maybe George Orwell would be a better read. (Just cut to the chase, fellas!)

  202. NYPete says:

    I think it would be just great if a public school football coaches marched to the 50 yard line at halftime, faced Mecca, prostrated themselves and chanted the Asr, Maghrib or Isha prayers.

    Not sure how Athos would feel about that, as he wants to only indoctrinate public school children in Christian theology, but certainly worth a try.

  203. Anonymous says:

    Well Thomas if the employer may prevent a teacher from saying certain things then why wouldn’t the same employer be able to prevent a teacher (who apparently also happens to coach a team) from saying things?

  204. Anonymous says:

    Everyone prayed in school?

    “In two landmark judgments in 1962 (Engel v. Vitale, 370 U.S. 421 (1962)
    School-sponsored prayer in public schools is unconstitutional). and 1963 (Abington School District v. Schempp, 374 U.S. 203 (1963) ,”no state law or school board may require that passages from the Bible be read or that the Lord’s Prayer be recited in the public schools of a State at the beginning of each school day — even if individual students may be excused from attending or participating in such exercises upon written request of their parents. the U.S. Supreme Court declared organized public school prayer to be unconstitutional.”)

    and maybe the reason why “everyone” (snicker) “prayed”?

    “In the 1840s and throughout much of the 19th century, school prayer and Bible reading were used in an attempt to discriminate against Catholics and other religious groups.

    There are examples of Catholic students being whipped and harassed and priests being tarred and feathered and ridden on rails, which involved parading someone around on a wooden rail. Catholics were even killed when they refused to participate in prayer and Bible reading in the common schools.”

    “During the 19th and early 20th centuries, school prayer was challenged in court by some citizens affected by it for violating state constitutions. These early cases often found that state-mandated school prayer violated the constitution of the state in question. One of these landmark cases, decided in 1872, is “Board of Education of Cincinnati v. Minor.”

    https://theconversation.com/history-shows-why-school-prayer-is-so-divisive-94085

    lol

  205. Athos says:

    petey, what Muslim Patriot was part of our Founding Fathers? That’s one that I can’t seem to recall. Maybe you can help me out here!

    Here’s where you and anny totally miss the point. With the exception of our elite academia, and the coastal elites that own much of our media and culture, this country is still overwhelmingly a Christian nation (and yes, anny, that definitely includes the Catholics!) You have overplayed your hand with the teacher/groomer dogma that you so desperately fight for. People are revulsed and will fight back to the death because YOUR GOING AFTER THEIR CHILDREN.

    You also (in your juvenile thinking process) don’t fully understand the rulings of the Supreme’s back in the day. Prayer (or Scripture reading) was never “kicked out” of school. Let me quote from the Engel’s case: “it is no part of the business of government to compose official prayers for any group of the American people to recite as a part of a religious program carried on by government.”
    But students are are fully free to pray in public schools — alone or in groups, as long as they don’t disrupt the school or interfere with the rights of others.

    And the argument can be made that Christian children today are being taught moral relativism in direct contradiction to their faith..along with evolution and the big Bang theory. Which leads me back to how we conservatives (and Christians) should have never ceded the framework of the argument.

    And just for the record, the Supremes are not God. It is my fervent hope that they throw the abortion issue back to be determined by each state (cause that group of Supremes REALLY whipped up that ruling out of whole cloth).

    And for the record, people prayed in my school in the 60s. And everybody prayed (or at least allowed prayer in the public square) following September 11, 2001. (But I forget, that was before you fellas time, huh?)

  206. NYPete says:

    Ah yes, here it is: America is a “Christian nation,” except for those decadent, sexually perverse “coastal elites” who “own the media.” And we know exactly which rootless cosmopolitans you are referring to.
    So in addition to your virulent homophobia we can add unabashed antisemitism.

  207. Anonymous says:

    The idea that “everyone prayed” is about as ridiculous as the myth about the old west and everyone carrying guns cause the knew their Second Amendment Rights.

  208. Athos says:

    I keep forgetting that you’re only a young pup (you really weren’t of age after 9/11, were you?) so I forgive your continued lying and name calling, cause that’s all you young ‘uns have, isn’t it? Or is it a Saul Alinsky-Leftist quirk? Anyway, rail all you want, you can’t change facts anymore that you can change genders!

    How about that Elon Musk character buying Twitter? Aren’t they the guys that hushed up the Hunter Biden Laptop story in October 2020? Funny how they banned the NY Post (the true paper of record) and allow “Trump as a Russian Tool” from the disgraced Grey Lady.

    We’ll all have to wait and see what this “new Sheriff in town” is gonna do!

  209. Anonymous says:

    Please identify the name calling that you reference or the lie for that matter.

  210. Anonymous says:

    That’s what I thought

  211. Athos says:

    “So in addition to your virulent homophobia we can add unabashed antisemitism.” Homophobia is a made up term to try and silence anyone that recognizes reality and wants normal, standard man/woman relations.

    Study history! People carried guns when migrating to the West for many reasons. Food being one of the main ones (you’re too young to imagine a time when there were no grocery stores with packaged meat, huh?)

    And antisemitism is slanderous lie. Once again, all you have is the phony power to shut people up, that have opposing views because you can’t articulate your own sick twisted absence from reality.

    And now Brandon is going to appoint a Disinformation Ministry as a part of Homeland Security. You know, the agency with all the guns. And what a dingleberry he appointed to run it! Laptop denying, promoter of British ex-spy Christopher Steele’s discredited dossier on Trump, off key singing bimbo.

    Yep. That’s our Brandon!

    As to young pups, I put petey and anny in the same group. USUALLY, when you grow older, you give up foolish leftist ideas (cause they destroy everything they touch… our cities… our marriages….our children in school….our inner city families…. our justice system……etc.)

  212. NYPete says:

    “With the exception of our elite academia, and the coastal elites that own much of our media and culture, this country is still overwhelmingly a Christian nation.”
    Yeah, tell me more about these terrible, un-American Christian coastal elites who own the media and culture. Then tell me you aren’t an anti-Semitic bigot who is also a homophobe.

  213. Anonymous says:

    I figure most people would be able to separate out people based on the screennames they use but obviously Athos isn’t most people.

    To be clear anonymous and NYPete are two different people.

    And while you made your allegation about namecalling and lying after a post from anonymous, you obviously included both of us in that allegation so I’m asking you to cite some example of namecalling you see otherwise…

    “Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour” (Exodus 20:16)

  214. Athos says:

    “Pete how many times does he have to say that this freedom of religion taught in schools goes ONLY for “good” religions like Christianity and…well that’s it for now.” Anny, April 18, 2022 at 7:38 am

    That’s one lie, anny. And as to you and petey being 2 different people, I’ll take your word for that, but you definitely have the same mind set.

    Or do you?

    petey, our Freedom rests on our nation being a Moral people that believe in God. Prior to the ascension of Barry O to Commander in Thief, 80% of America identified as Christian. (5% non Christian and 15% no religion) That was 2008! And when I was a wee lad, over 95% of Americans identified as Christians.

    And wouldn’t you know it, 7 years ago (2015) 18 to 29 year olds were 30+% no religion (62% IDed as Christian!) And the US Jewish population has always been around 2.5% (5.8 million adults). For your information, the man that I worship (that happens to be the son of God and 1 part of the Holy Trinity) is Jewish. So, of course, I’m not an ” anti-Semitic bigot” but that is a popular (and way overused) tactic of the childish leftist. And what IS a homophobe if not a made up word? This is where you insert your definition, which won’t match my speech.

    You fellas (and your ilk) have lost your minds. Please tell me you don’t REALLY think that Biden’s latest George Orwell creation (the Ministry of Truth) lead by https://twitter.com/cwt_news/status/1520044670193127426?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1520044670193127426%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.zerohedge.com%2Fpolitical%2Fwatch-bidens-new-russia-hoaxer-disinfo-queen-goes-full-libs-tiktok

    is something you can accept and embrace?

    And fellas, here is your chance to present your ideas (as opposed to your usual false name calling, and outright lies)

  215. Athos says:

    Well now, why would anyone leak Alito’s brief on Roe v Wade?

  216. NYPete says:

    Because they see Kavanaugh or Barrett as waivering in signing onto a 100% overturning of Roe and a repudiation of the constitutional right to privacy, and they want to make sure those votes are locked in by showing that they signed onto Alito’s first draft.

  217. Anonymous says:

    Why would anyone care who leaked a brief when the result is the one they’ve fought for for years?

    Seems like finding out what your grade is going to be in school earlier than you thought it was coming and that was never a bad thing when you were getting the one you wanted, but the right seems upset about it; wonder why that is?

  218. Anonymous says:

    Wait a minute, maybe this is why: (and just in time for the mid-term elections too….)

    “An overwhelming majority of Americans are in favor of preserving abortion rights, two new polls have found, as the US supreme court moves towards ending almost half a century of protections.

    A Politico/Morning Consult study found voters are two to one in favor of preserving the 1973 Roe v Wade opinion that safeguarded protected women’s access to abortions.”

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/live/2022/may/04/abortion-supreme-court-roe-v-wade-public-opinion-biden-trump-us-politics-latest

  219. It was released in an attempt to bring pressure on the justices to NOT overturn Roe and Casey. Duh.

  220. NYPete says:

    Nope. Anyone working at the Supreme Court would know that a leak would (in the words of libertarian professor Josh Blackman,) entrench the five-member majority to avoid the appearance that the pressure campaign worked. Any why would someone seeking to keep Roe/Casey from being overturned leak a draft from early February? Much more likely that the leak was intended to freeze that opinion in place — to keep someone like Roberts from convincing Kavanaugh or Barrett to insist that the opinion be weakened into a dilution of Roe/Casey rather than the complete repudiation of any constitutional right to privacy and personal autonomy that Alito’s draft represents.

  221. Athos says:

    Ah yes, Tom. It seems the rule of law means nothing to the left. If they don’t get their way, it’s perfectly acceptable to destroy traditions, break laws, and ignore crimes. And I wonder what part of “Abortion is Health Care” applies to babies?

    Maybe now we can educate people as to what this “procedure” actually is, and start calling it brutal murder of the most defenseless.

    And anny, if so many people want abortion, then why are you afraid to bring it to a vote by the people? Allow Federalism to live!

  222. NYPete says:

    It is unfortunate that you want women who use IUDs or who use IVF procedures to get pregnant to be thrown in jail, along with their doctors.

  223. Athos says:

    False argument, petey, and you’re lying again. Abortion will not be the Federal law of the land, it will go back to the states to decide. Nevada has it hard wired into state law. So this ruling won’t affect me at all (until we can put it up for a vote again).

    You can now thank me for educating you, or apologize for lying!

  224. NYPete says:

    Oh, so you are pro-abortion. How bi-coastal of you.

  225. Athos says:

    Only a child or a mentally challenged partisan could deduce my position as “…pro-abortion…”; but then I repeat myself, don’t I, petey? As to your “worth reading” fairy tale, (funny how spontaneous protests and outing Supreme Justice home addresses were part of a right wing, John Roberts, leak) I’ll just wait until they perp walk who ever did this.

    But the other big case that isn’t getting any attention is the “prayer on the 50 yard line” opinion. It’s almost like the left is trying to ban prayer, religion and God in the public square. Wrong! If our rights don’t come from God (generic, axiomatic or what ever) then they must come from government. Our constitution was designed (and indeed our beloved republic) for the government to safeguard our inalienable rights. It would seem that Brandon and the boys would rather have our rights come from government! (as long as it isn’t Donald Trump!)

  226. NYPete says:

    Oh OK, my bad: you do indeed want women who use IUDs or who use IVF procedures to get pregnant to be thrown in jail, along with their doctors.
    Thanks for clearing that up.

  227. Athos says:

    I’ve lost track of the number of times you’ve lied, petey. Of course, that’s just a leftist SOP, isn’t it? How funny! Just out of curiosity, what state will these pregnant women and their doctors be thrown in jail?

    And why can’t you make up a funny story about from where our rights are derived? What’s the SOP leftist falsehood for that question, petey? (or anny can take a swipe at that one, too!)

    Here’s a good one: Republicans get voted out of office when they don’t hold to their basic beliefs. Democrats get tossed out when they do enact their basic beliefs!

    And since your into story telling, recap how Brandon got 81million votes (thanks to the anti racist mail in ballot)

  228. NYPete says:

    You believe that abortion is homicide and that protectible human life begins at conception. IUDs work by expelling the blastocyte after conception, and everyone knows that IVF involves disposing of “extra” embryos.
    As we know that you are nothing if not morally consistent, you cannot wish to outlaw abortion without necessarily wanting to oppose IUDs and in-vitro fertilization. And, if abortion is murder, why aren’t women who actively seek abortions and who take abortion-inducing drugs murderers?

  229. Athos says:

    AT last! A conversation where you attempt to promote your beliefs (by projecting your erroneous opinions on me – with the mandatory insults thrown in!). Nice.

    The real question is “when does life begin”, isn’t it? And those of us on the moral side (which is positively required if we are to keep our Republic, don’t you think?) recognize the biological truth- is when a woman is pregnant. I wouldn’t want to put words in your mouth, but the argument from the left (that irks the right) equates abortion (murdering an infant in the womb) with birth control.

    I don’t oppose birth control. If you have a problem with IUDS, then I would suggest using a condom, or having your significant other go on the pill. And what is your beef with in-virtro? Not sure I get your drift there…….

  230. NYPete says:

    You believe life begins at pregnancy, which begins at conception. IUDs expel the baby after conception occurs. In vitro fertilization almost always involves destruction of unwanted embryos. You want to make both IUDs and IVF a criminal offense, because what to you are the murder of babies. To those of you on what you call “the moral side” both IUDs and IVF are homicide and those who engage in it, women and doctors alike, are murderers.

  231. Athos says:

    Why are you continually trying to tell me my own beliefs? Am I not clear enough for you? Where did I EVER say I ” want to make both IUDs and IVF a criminal offense…”?? Is that what YOU believe, petey? Do you have no conception of what the term “fetus” means? Have you never heard of the “quickening”? And speaking of Doctors, was Dr. Kermit Gosnell a murderer? Or one of your poster boys?

    Why do your arguments twist the truth and presuppose what people mean? Have leftists given themselves over to being a bunch of wanna be “Carnac the Magnificent” disciples?

    And why can’t you just say it, petey? Abortion IS the murder of an unborn innocent baby. Your reasoning (or lack thereof) reduces mankind to that of meat puppet. No soul, no Spirit, no future.
    Only self. The all important self.

  232. NYPete says:

    So you think abortion should be banned after quickening but not before? OK, we could probably compromise on that. It’s a deal.

  233. NYPete says:

    BTW, that’s about 16-20 weeks.

  234. Athos says:

    Wrong again, petey. Maybe you should check with your momma about when she first knew you were inside her. And with today’s technology, they know much, much more than in St. Thomas Aquinas’ day.

    Besides, once abortion is kicked back to the states (to let the states decide AS THE PEOPLE VOTE) what are you worried about, leftist? All I hear about from your fellow leftists is how people overwhelmingly want abortion.

    Now they can vote on it (you know, democracy!). Ain’t this a wonderful country (except for those immoral lunatics that allow judicial intimidation outside the homes of the Supremes – and I’m talking about our very own AG Merrick Garland. Why won’t you leftists uphold the law evenly????)

  235. NYPete says:

    So you don’t think that protectable human life begins at conception, and you don’t think that protectable human life begins at quickening. Or perhaps you do, but, based on your medical training you think that it occurs somewhat earlier than the 20 weeks that actual medical experts say it takes place in first-time mothers. (But you won’t say when.) Or, perhaps you think protectable human life begins before pregnancy can be visualized on an ultrasound — because, I suppose everyone knows that begins at the moment of ultrasound. You anti-abortionists are so confusing! Maybe you can clear things up by just telling us at what stage of the pregnancy protectable life begins and when the woman and the doctor should be tried for murder and executed by lethal injection.

  236. Athos says:

    You are a blood thirsty son of a female dog, petey. Wanting Lethal Injections for woman and doctors! Good thing no one knows the meaning of the word “woman”, huh?
    Sucks if you’re a doctor though. Maybe they should identify as butchers!

    AND

    If you’re too embarrassed to ask your Mom (or if she’s passed or is indisposed) maybe you have 1 close female friend that had a baby, and you can ask her when she thought life began in her womb.

    That way, you won’t be so confused about all those voices in your head telling you what I believe. Because God only knows I’ve been as patently obvious as humanly possible about protecting the life of the unborn baby.

    Still no acknowledgement from you about Roe v Wade being kicked back to the States for the people to decide. Doesn’t help your “world’s on fire” messaging service, does it? How about Brandon’s inflation and economic downturn (as caused by his disastrous policies)??

    Is the term “Ultra-MAGA” gonna save our economy?

    G’night, groomer!

  237. NYPete says:

    If, as you seem to believe, life begins at conception (although teasing logic out of your posts is perhaps a feckless task,) and abortion is murder, then IUDs and IVFs are forms of murder. You do believe in the death penalty, right for murder, right?

  238. Athos says:

    You haven’t talked to your momma yet, have you? When you do, you’ll be rewarded with some real wisdom, instead of this “make believe intelligence” you keep posting. And you won’t come off as a petulant 15 year old that can’t take being “owned” by a Musketeer! Or, is all this blood thirsty killing and murder you’re projecting really a cry for help, petey?

    Do you think the Empire State will pass an abortion law for their constituents? Nevada has a state law now, but I wonder if we could get it overturned? Awful lot of Catholics moving to our state. (Of course that’s really no guarantee, is it?)

  239. NYPete says:

    You could end all this confusion by simply stating at what stage of pregnancy you believe abortion should be made illegal. It says a lot that you either cannot do so.

  240. NYPete says:

    or will not do so.

  241. Athos says:

    I’m not confused. I know exactly when my wife was pregnant with the life of our child inside of her. There was never a question of ending that life. To do so is unthinkable. Why would anyone want to end the life of a baby in the womb, petey? That would spell the end of mankind.

    Can you tell me what sort of entity would want the end of mankind, petey? And why would it matter to a person living in NY? Are you implying that you New Yorkers would ban abortion? Would you feel betrayed if your fellow New Yorkers banned abortion in your state?

  242. NYPete says:

    Great – so do tell us – at what stage of pregnancy does protectable human life begin? be criminalized? At conception? At quickening? Some time in between?

  243. Anonymous says:

    Thomas:

    Any comment about the recent 5th Circuit decision handing Texas a victory over those bad internet companies?

    “Texas residents can now sue Facebook, Twitter and YouTube for allegedly censoring their content after a federal appeals court sided Wednesday with the state’s law restricting how social media sites can moderate their platforms.

    The 15-word ruling allowing the law, which had been blocked last year, to take effect has significant potential consequences. Most immediately, it creates new legal risks for the tech giants, and opens them up to a possible wave of litigation that legal experts say would be costly and difficult to defend.”

  244. Anonymous says:

    In case anyone did know

  245. It is merely a stay of a lower court order blocking the law. I’m not sure a law forcing someone — even the ubiquitous social media — to publish a third party comment comports the “free speech” concept. Everyone is free to speak or not speak.

  246. Anonymous says:

    I think what they did was lift the stay so as to allow the law to come into effect.

    And I’m wondering whether you think forcing these social media companies to “speak” on their sites, lest they be subject to legal action, is consistent with your interpretation of the First Amendment?

  247. Anonymous says:

    I agree with you

  248. Athos says:

    petey, there are just some things that can’t be explained to you (no matter how slow I type!) until you get married, and have children of your own. So if you want answers to the question of when life begins, (and you refuse to believe what I’ve told you) then you MUST go ask your mother and let her inform you. I’m hoping you do have a mother (and I’m not trying to be insensitive, here). OK? And just to be clear, you understand what the abortion procedure DOES to a baby, right?

    Anny, why do you quote BS from that former newspaper (but now a shill for the Leftist Democrat party) NY Times? The old grey lady is D-E-D, Dead! That spells “woke-a-joke reality has no place in this news print! (And the only way to view it is to subscribe which I refuse to do – ’cause like the “Hotel California – you can check out but you can never leave!” when you give your plastic to the NYT (or so the rumors say).

    Anyway, I thought those large platforms are “common carrier” public forums, like the phone companies and couldn’t discriminate like they do. Wouldn’t I have a right to sue Verizon if they wouldn’t let me make a call?

  249. NYPete says:

    I took your advice and asked a bunch of moms (including mine) when they thought protectable human life began. They all gave me different answers. Some said the moment of conception. Some said end of the first trimester, a few the second, a few mentioned quickening, a few said they had no idea.

    Now, we want to know your view. Would you support a law that declared that life begins at conception and that anything that deliberately or recklessly ends that life is murder? Since you care so passionately about overturning Roe v. Wade, you must have strong views about where the legal line should be drawn, yet you have steadfastly refused to express them.

  250. Anonymous says:

    Althos

    you’re childishness ignorance is probably a credit to you among your kind, but I ain’t your kind.

  251. Athos says:

    petey, you need to take a few more lessons on “how to lie” So, a few said they had no idea?? Whoops, here comes the baby! Roe v Wade was bad law. We need to let the States determine what the law should be. As I already told you, my wife knew when there was life inside her. So did my mom. So did my sister. So did my sister in law.

    You really should get a better batch of female acquaintances, petey. Or come up with a better lie.

    And anny, if you wish to rejoin the land of reality, and forsake the power mad leftists, you are always welcome. I’m sure you can appreciate this one (from the big Fella, Himself!) Matthew 18:3 “Truly I tell you,” He said, “unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven”

    And the NYT is still a shill for the corrupt, leftist Democrat party.

  252. NYPete says:

    In other words, you don’t know when protectable human life begins, but you want to leave that decision up to individual women — your sister-in-law, etc. They each have their own opinions and make their own decisions.
    Sounds like you are pro-choice. Congratulations.

  253. Anonymous says:

    Job 13:5

    If only you would remain silent; for that would be your wisdom!

  254. Athos says:

    petey, you are a moron. Your leap of logic is illogical. And the desire to kill babies in the womb is evil. The problem is ……. that you know it, don’t you? Shortly after conception (sperm fertilizes egg) women feel differently. When is that? It is different for different women. But they know. And they also know (and so does everyone else that believes in reality) that it isn’t a clump of cells like cancer. The argument for abortion is deeply flawed. Read up on the Jewish child sacrifice to the pagan god Molek or Molech. In the field of Gehenna. It’s found in the book of Jeremiah and in the writings of Josephus.

    So yes, you have a right to privacy but not to kill another human being. That is found NO WHERE in our Constitution.

    Anny, I like where you’re going. “Almighty God, the fountain of all wisdom…” but let’s jump ahead to the teachings of Jesus, shall we? “Seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you”
    If only this country would turn back to the Lord, and our Christian roots. We may find favor with God once again, and fulfill our Destiny. (As that shining city on the hill – “a beacon, still a magnet for all who must have freedom, for all the pilgrims from all the lost places who are hurtling through the darkness, toward home.” RR farewell address) and no, we can’t have freedom if we have an open boarder) I may be wrong, but I don’t believe Joe Brandon is gonna take us to that promised land!

  255. NYPete says:

    Oh, OK. So protectible human life begins when women start throwing up. It’s the famous scientific/theological “morning sickness” standard: life begins at upchuck. If you take Mifepristone after that, off to Death Row you go!

  256. Anonymous says:

    Athos says:

    May 15, 2022 at 10:44 pm

    “petey, you are a moron…”

    Jesus said:

    “whoever insults his brother will be liable to the council; and whoever says, “You fool!” will be liable to the hell of fire. (Matthew 5:21–22,

  257. Athos says:

    Give up, petey. You lost. Miserably. Your logic is flawed, and your values are corrupt. But it was nice playing with you, petey! You need to stick to the echo chambers that your fellow leftist inhabit.

    Anny! Quoting scripture for reproof and instruction of my mortal soul! I’m touched, and thank you! Fortunately we all have 1John 1:9. So I’m not in peril of Gehenna, am I?

  258. NYPete says:

    So at what stage in pregnancy should abortion be criminalized?

  259. Athos says:

    What stage in pregnancy should abortion be legal? And are you now admitting that the term “abortion” is the taking of life?

  260. NYPete says:

    I will tell you what – as you have a habit of refusing to answer straight-forward questions while posing your own questions, I will make a deal with you. Provide us with a straight-forward, one-sentence answer to the question I posed to you and then I will do the same for both of the questions you posed to me. A 2-for-1 deal — who could turn that down?

  261. Athos says:

    I have already answered your “straight-forward question(s)” several different ways, but it isn’t the answer you want so you have no ability to see it! And continually ask for me to give you ANOTHER answer.Why don’t you tell me what answer you want, and I’ll see if I can agree, OK?

    But just to be clear, no right to privacy law gives anyone the legal right to kill another human being. If you remove that plank to your “abortion rights” platform, the entire structure comes crashing down.

    And maybe we could go back to the days that people took their responsibility and married and raised their child. OMG, put the needs of their child ahead of their own selfish needs!

    I’d definitely be in favor of that, how about you???

  262. NYPete says:

    No, the problem is that you won’t tell us when in pregnancy abortion should be criminalized. All you can say is “well, whenever it was that my mama felt that she might be pregnant.” You can’t really write a law that affects tens of millions of people that way. Just answer the question – at what stage of pregnancy should abortion be illegal. Is it after conception? After a heatbeat is determined? After a woman misses her period? After she can feel the baby kick? Just answer that question and then I will give a straight-forward answer to your own question.

  263. Athos says:

    petey, are you a bot? You can’t give a straight forward answer, because it would reveal how corrupt you are, and there is no way you can accept that chunk of truth about yourself. What you want is “cover” or a “justified excuse” to kill babies. You know (or should be aware) that over 90% of abortions are for “convenience”. How can you possibly deal with that stat without losing your sanity? or more to the point, losing your humanity?

    When (and if) Roe is overturned, it will go back to the individual states to be enacted into law. The farce that is all things democrat wanting to enact a federal law keeping abortion legal up to the second of birth, was telling, wasn’t it?

    And you never checked out Molech and the fields of Gehenna, did you? You probably never asked your mother, either, because bots don’t have mothers, do they?

    I do hope these posts are earning Tom a little ching-a chang-a!

  264. NYPete says:

    OK, I think we have pretty must established that you either will not or cannot answer the simple, straight-forward question of when you believe protectible human life begins and thus when you believe abortion should be criminialized. That seems quite revealing.

  265. Athos says:

    So, you ARE a bot!! You’ve been owned and you keep doubling down! THAT’S what’s quite revealing, petey (and must have been pretty much established)!!
    It’s too bad reading comprehension wasn’t stressed at your school. Probably too busy with those 101 gender studies, huh?

  266. NYPete says:

    One certainly doesn’t need to take a course in the science, philosophy and sociology of gender to know that you have deliberately and repeatedly refused to answer the crucial, basic question of when you believe protectible human life begins and thus when you believe abortion should be criminialized.

  267. Athos says:

    So, when does “protectible human life begin..”, petey? When did yours begin? Maybe a biology course in school would help you out, you think?

    Loser! You should really stop whining and suck it up, buttercup! (And I mean that in the most Christian way possible, anny!)

  268. NYPete says:

    As I have already said, you habitually refuse to answer straight-forward questions, while posing questions of your own. Once you have told us at what stage in a woman’s pregnancy you think abortion should be made illegal, I will provide my own answer.
    But here is an even easier way to articulate the same question that you seem unwilling or unable to answer: The State of Oklahoma just made it illegal to end a pregnancy at any stage from the moment of fertilization onwards. Do you agree with that law?

  269. Athos says:

    When does life begin? You want a simple conservative Christian to answer that question? Here you go – life begins when life begins. Here is the real problem, Mr. Bot. Abortion is designed to end the life that has begun. That is the taking of an innocent life. That is what I find abhorrent. And that is found NO WHERE in our Constitution, no matter WHAT the Burger Court said. Does that answer shed anymore light on your Bot question?

    You argue from the standpoint of death and destruction. You bots only want to tear down the greatest civilization that has been on this earth, to date. Liberty means nothing to you. Morals are fleeting thoughts that change with the wind. Your principles are corruption, bondage, fear and power. Your bible is Saul Alinsky’s “Rules for Radicals”. You react to the very term MAGA (which stands for Make America Great Again) like a vampire reacts to garlic and sunlight!

    You really should reflect on life, and the damage you’ve done to our society. But then again, bots aren’t really people, are they?

  270. NYPete says:

    To say that life begins when life begins is to avoid answering the question. You really are afraid to say at what stage of a woman’s pregnancy abortion should be made illegal. Is it when Oklahoma has set it — the moment of fertilization?

  271. Athos says:

    When is the “moment of fertilization”? And who will be there to check? The Oklahoma Too-Sooners? Once again, bot man, you are hoisted on your own petard! Avoidance of “the question” is your middle name, petey.

    Embrace it, or explain yourself. The main aim of abortion is to end a life, correct? And when is it legal, or moral, to end an innocent life? And when do you say life begins? If you have a life in the womb, then killing that life should not be legal, right? Thus, abortion is murder and evil.

    So when do you know you have a life in the womb, petey? Or is this the kind of question you can’t (or won’t) answer (like, “what is a woman?”) How ridiculous you leftist look not being able to answer a simple question. (on the Supreme Court, no less!! Wow. There’s a legal mind for you, huh?)

    You see, you can’t have a discussion with someone if you can’t be truthful. We can argue, but you have to present some semblance of logic and intelligence to the conversation. Otherwise, I give you truth, and you refuse (or are unable) to comprehend. And all you can do is pout and cry (very unbecoming)

    It’s really hard to have a conversation with a bot. But it does give me a chance to articulate my beliefs, so thank you!

  272. NYPete says:

    1. So, you seem to be saying that you oppose the new Oklahoma law (and the view of the Catholic Church) that any abortion after the moment of conception is murder, because it is difficult to determine when fertilization occurs. But you steadfastly refuse to say at what point in pregnancy abortion should be banned. Is it at the moment a woman receives a positive pregnancy test result? That is almost immediately after fertilization and implantation, so what’s the difference?
    2. By the way, if, as you say, any abortion is murder and an absolute evil, why shouldn’t both the woman and her doctor receive the death penalty?

  273. Athos says:

    1. You, dear bot petey, are the one that STEADFASTLY REFUSEs to say at what point life begins! Obviously, your DNA (along with all leftist’ creed) is about lying and misrepresenting plain facts. There is no mention of the “new Oklahoma law” in my posts. And I’ve REPEATEDLY stated what point abortion should be banned!! Can’t you understand plain English? Step up your game, petey-bot! Your handlers will be so disappointed!!

    2. You are such a turd blossom, petey! Maybe the woman AND her doctor DON’T receive the death penalty is because it’s currently LEGAL to kill a baby in the womb. Roe v Wade being overturned, will no longer give the States legal cover. NOW, it will be up to the individual states.

    Tom, we really need a smarter set of bots for your blog! Although it is fun decimating Leftist Wanna Be New Yorkers!

  274. NYPete says:

    Your non-answer to the fundamental question of when protectible life begins was: “When does life begin? You want a simple conservative Christian to answer that question? Here you go – life begins when life begins.”
    At other times you have written that life begins when a woman thinks it begins. That sounds suspiciously pro-choice, but then you deny that.
    When you are able to give a clear-cut answer to this fundamental question, let us know.
    In the meantime, it is helpful to know that you have no objection to a state prescribing the death penalty to a woman for having an abortion.

  275. NYPete says:

    A reminder in Texas this afternoon that for today’s conservatives the right to life truly does begin at conception and end at birth.

  276. Athos says:

    Jeez, petey. What’s that suppose to mean? You could be the new press secretary for that “great uniter” Joe Brandon! (Never waste a “good” crisis, huh?)

    Either that or “bots just gotta bot”!

  277. Athos says:

    Oh, and you’ve peaked my curiosity, bot. Just exactly what woman has been prescribed the death penalty for having an abortion?

  278. NYPete says:

    You believe that abortion is murder, and you believe in the death penalty for murder. Seems logical enough.

    On the other hand, you still shy away from giving your own answer to the fundamental question of when protectible life begins.

  279. Athos says:

    Non answers for bots with non answers, petey. Seems only fair! And your nasty habit of jumping to conclusions is sooooo juvenile! Why don’t you try a new schtick? Or better yet, give me the name of the last woman put to death for having an abortion in the US?

    “Anyone?”

    “Anyone?”

    “Anyone?”

    “Class? Anyone?”

    “Bueller?”

    “Bueller?”

    “Bueller?”

  280. NYPete says:

    So you believe abortion is murder, that the destruction of a blastocyst is infanticide, but that those who direct and commit the murder should go completely unpunished. That is a very perverse morality you have there.

  281. Athos says:

    What??? You can’t provide the name of the last person put to death for having an abortion?? How about the name of ANYONE put to death for having an abortion?
    And just WHEN are you going to stop characterizing what you THINK I believe? Show me where I said “… that the destruction of a blastocyst is infanticide…” I’ll just wait for your bot answer, petey!

    Here, I’ll even play a “petey-bot” ….. You don’t believe in our inalienable right to life. You are perfectly OK with taking the life of another human being. Therefore, you are not an American and your logo of NY is bogus.

    Now that I think of it, you’re probably some troll who lives in Russia, and has the Hillary campaign headquarters on speed dial!

    I nailed it, didn’t I??

  282. NYPete says:

    Oh, OK. So you think Oklahoma is wrong and life doesn’t begin at conception. But you refuse to say when it does begin.
    And, although you believe abortion is murder, you refuse to say whether it should be prosecuted as murder.

  283. Athos says:

    Ok, bot. You are a broken record, now. Why don’t you just copy what you’ve said and paste it again after my post?

  284. NYPete says:

    OK, sure: You are afraid to answer the basic questions that are key to the entire abortion debate: when does protectible human life begin, and, therefore, when should the taking of that protectible human life be prosecuted as murder.
    I understand why you wouldn’t want to answer that question, but your refusal to do so says so much, not only about you, but about the movement of which you are such an outstanding representative.

  285. Athos says:

    Copy and paste, petey-bot! That’s the way to win the day! Don’t give any answers yourself! You may give away the store and allow Christianity to ascend, again!

    Gee, I wonder how many women received the death penalty prior to the 1973 RoeVWade debacle? How did they decide when life began back then??

    Wanna take a stab at that one, petey-bot?

    Hmmmmmm??

  286. NYPete says:

    If abortion is murder, why would you treat murderers differently? And it is only doctors who should be prosecuted?

  287. Athos says:

    More copy and paste, petey-bot?

    What is your definition of murder?

    Bonus bot points – what is your definition of a woman?

    Super bonus bot points – why do we need the 2nd amendment?

    Off you go little bot! Busy busy busy!

  288. NYPete says:

    I will answer your new questions (however absurd,) after you answer the questions you have to date refused to answer: at what point in pregnancy should abortion should be made illegal?

  289. Athos says:

    Stop being a blind child, petey-bot. What part of “when life begins” don’t you understand? How patently absurd you leftist children are!

    Oh, wait a minute, I’m arguing with a bot! You have no understanding of “when life begins” just like you have no answer for “what is a woman?”

    Take your mentally ill show on the road (and please get the kind of therapy that helps).

  290. NYPete says:

    If you have a view as to when protectable human life begins and at which stage of pregnancy abortion should be prohibited by the state you certainly have not shown it. Perhaps that is because you are afraid of the implications.

  291. Athos says:

    petey-bot, if you really want the answer, go ask your mother! Otherwise, you must be afraid of facing the truth AND the science of when life begins.

    You do believe in the science, don’t you? Perhaps you are afraid of the implications of being labeled a science denier?

  292. NYPete says:

    The issue of when protectible human life begins and of when abortion should be made illegal is more a philosophical-theological-moral matter than it is a scientific one. That is why so many people — including mothers — have different views. However, I am pleased that you have finally conceded that the issue of when an abortion should be made illegal should be left to the choice of the individual woman, based on her own view of when protectible human life begins and at what stage of pregnancy she should not have an abortion.

  293. Athos says:

    Idiot! petey-bot is an idiot! Number 1) you are crediting me with speech I have never made, and supporting ideas that I’ve never stated. That is called libel. Or gas lighting. Or flat out delusional lying. Take your pick.

    Number 2) Once the Supreme Court tosses out RoevWade, it will be up to the individual state legislatures along with their Governors to decide when life begins and abortion ends. You should have stayed awake in civics class.

    And I was totally unaware that “bots” could be “pleased” (especially getting spanked over and over again)!

    Thanks for playing!

  294. NYPete says:

    You said that only a mother can answer the question of when protectible human life begins. That means the individual woman. Not state legislators, political parties, Fox News talking heads, etc. The woman. Each one makes an individual determination. A choice. You are a pro-choicer.
    If you are not, you should be able to finally answer the question of when protectible human life begins and at what state abortion should be made illegal.

  295. Athos says:

    I said for you to ask YOUR mother, not “that only a mother can answer the question of when protectible human life begins”…. Get your facts straight, petey-bot! I understand your confusion because “bots” can’t have mothers, can they?

    However…….

    Your logic is flawed and your ability to comprehend simple speech has been destroyed by your leftist friends! What’s the matter with you? When are you going to comprehend simple sentences? Your contempt for all things decent, and your avoidance of truth and science have put you in a very dangerous mental condition.

    Maybe it’s time to go back to church?

  296. NYPete says:

    What if my mother and your mother and the mother of the guy down the street all have different answers? What answer did your mother give you? (You must know, as you a certain that abortion is murder and must be criminalized.)

  297. Athos says:

    What did your mom say? (Cut and paste time, petey-bot!)

  298. Athos says:

    By the way, happy D-Day. 6-6-44 was a big day in France.

  299. NYPete says:

    She said that she wasn’t sure, especially because she wasn’t certain what the concept of “protectible human life” meant, and it would likely differ from woman to woman, depending on their individual philosophies, religious beliefs or lack thereof, emotional state, personal background, relationship with the person who impregnated her, etc. She said that if she had to come down one way or another she would say that protectible human life began at quickening, although she could certainly see special circumstances where an abortion might be appropriate after that point.
    What did your Mom say?

  300. Athos says:

    When is quickening? And when did bots get a real mom?

  301. NYPete says:

    The fact that you do not know what quickening is helps explain why you are so unable to mount even the most rudamentary argument with respect to abortion.

  302. Athos says:

    The fact that you can’t answer “when is quickening” helps explain why you are so blinded in leftist ideology that truth can’t penetrate your bot skull! (Also, your logic is hopelessly flawed – asking “when” something happens is not on the same planet as not knowing what that something is.)

    You could save yourself a lot of grief by just admitting that you got your hat handed to you, petey-bot.

    Face it, you lost! When is that Supreme Court decision coming down, anyway?

  303. NYPete says:

    Unlike you, I am very familiar with the term I used and its legal/historical significance for abortion.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quickening

    By the way, this “truth” to which you refer is the idea of at which stage of pregnancy abortion should be banned. You are either unwilling to or incapable of stating when you believe that stage occurs.

  304. Athos says:

    Thank goodness for Wikipedia! Petey-bot can cut and paste! That makes petey-bot the smartest man in the kingdom!

    Hoo-ray for petey-bot! Instead of State Legislatures deciding the question of abortion, we should just turn to petey-bot! He’s got ALL the answers, don’t cha?

    You really GOT me that time, petey-bot. You sure showed me what for! What’s a thinking human being supposed to do against such overwhelming cut and paste power??

    Stay tuned…………

  305. NYPete says:

    Now that you have learned what quickening is, perhaps you can finally answer the question that you have been steadfastly avoiding about where in a woman’s pregnancy you would make abortion a criminal offense — is it quickening? Or are you still afraid?

  306. Athos says:

    Oh, was I supposed to read the wiki link? I thought you were just dazzling me with your brilliance!
    And remind me again what legislature I’m on that this would even come up?

    And I’m pretty sure that life begins when it begins. Otherwise you wouldn’t need to kill it in the womb, would you? (I typed that last part R-E-A-L S-L-O-W so you’d get it, petey-bot! And you’re welcome!)

    If you keep this up, you’ll have the sorest derrière out there! But maybe that’s what bot’s like, eh?

  307. NYPete says:

    So does that mean you think that protectible human life begins at the moment of conception? Saying that life begins when it begins is not very helpful.

  308. Athos says:

    Too bad you’re so slow to the uptake, petey-bot, but that is not my “call in life” to try and educate you.

    And bot’s are famous for lying (that’s you!) and hating life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Maybe you should try and just listen for a while. Of course, admitting that all the hate you project is wrong, and asking for forgiveness would be a very good start in getting the help you so desperately need.

    Just saying…..

  309. NYPete says:

    So it is therefore clear that you are unprepared and/or unwilling to answer the most fundamental questions about abortion: when in pregnancy should it be banned, what should the punishment be, and who should be punished.

  310. Athos says:

    And it is therefore exceedingly clear that you have no idea of anything of which you speak! Who makes the laws governing abortion, petey-bot? (I’ll give you a BIG hint….it’s not Athos!)

    It’s also exceedingly clear that you lust for the death of children in the womb! When will you be satisfied? What number of murdered babies will quell your blood lust?

    THAT is the questions you should concern yourself with, petey-bot!

    I’ll bet you can’t even answer the basic question….”What is a woman?”

  311. NYPete says:

    I will be happy to respond to your irrelevant questions about unrelated topics, but only after you provide a responsive answer to the base question of at what point in a woman’s pregnancy you believe an abortion should be criminalized.

  312. Athos says:

    Why is that, petey-bot? Since I’ve answered your question MULTIPLE TIMES and you refuse to accept plain English, what could you possibly want to hear? I believe a child in the womb should have the full protection of the law (and not be murdered). What problem do you have with that explanation?

    Arguing with an ignorant bot is like trying to teach a pig to sing, isn’t it?

  313. NYPete says:

    So you believe that protectable human life begins at the moment of conception, and that any action intended to end that life is murder or attempted murder and should be punished accordingly. That means that IVF procedures are murder. Morning after pills are murder. IUDs are surely murder. And, of course, any abortion of a pregnancy resulting from a sexual assault is murder.
    And you do believe in the death penalty for first degree murderr.
    Thanks for clearing that up.

  314. Athos says:

    Wow. Just spin away and try to credit me with saying things I’ve never said! What a great way to debate, petey-bot! No wait, that’s not debate, that’s just “shut up and talk no more, peon”. Is it any wonder people think you’re odious?

    That’s why you leftist failures will always lose, petey-bot. You live in a world of your own imagination, and heaven forbid (pun intended) you can’t come out to the real world.

    Shame, really. What really needs “clearing up” for you, is your world view.

    Come back to the Real World, petey-bot! You’ll be so much happier! And so will the babies!

  315. Athos says:

    Are you so arrogant that you really believe you know “the moment of conception”? Wow. Just a big fat wow. How does one get so blind to his own beliefs that instead of petey-bot, we should call you petey-god?

    Oh, and don’t forget about your love affair with killing human beings. I’m a bit surprised you left out men that masturbate (except for your friends, of course)! But when you are your own god, you can do anything, can’t you?

  316. NYPete says:

    Yes, I do know the moment of conception. That is a scientific term referring to the union of sperm and egg. That is the moment when you believe that protectible human life begins and when any attempt to interfere with development of the embryo into a fetus would be a criminal offense. Right?

  317. Athos says:

    “That is the moment when you believe…” There you go again, petey-godbot, attempting to speak for me. But that’s all you can really do, isn’t it? Lie about “science” and claim that I believe your lies, isn’t it?
    Why do you think that’s an acceptable procedure? Is it because of your “godbot” status? And as to “criminal offense” what State do you live in, again?? Oh yeah, NEW YORK, where abortion is legal state law!

    Now, how about that….!

  318. Athos says:

    I guess godbot’s never tire of being “owned” by live righteous human beings. That’s OK. I love mopping the floor with your illogical hate filled dogma.

    You may want to correct some of that corrupted code that guides you. Maybe a reboot?

  319. NYPete says:

    Hey, it is real easy: you just have to state, once and for all, at what point in the stages of pregnancy you believe intentional termination of the pregnancy should be criminalized. Is it at the moment of conception onwards? Or is it at some other stage? Time after time you refuse to come out and tell us where the law should draw the line. Just do it.

  320. Athos says:

    “Time after time you refuse to come out and tell us where the law should draw the line. Just do it.” What’s up, loser? You forced to copy Nike ads, now? What do you want, petey-godbot? You want me to put it all in caps? Is that the only way you’ll understand what I’m clearly typing? OK….

    THE LAW NEEDS TO PROTECT THE INNOCENT BABE IN THE WOMB. IT IS IMMORAL, BARBARIC AND MURDER TO KILL A BABY ONCE CONCEIVED.

    Get the picture, dufus?? Now, as to “scientific term referring to the union of sperm and egg” if YOU want to play god, maybe you could tell us when that happens. But my experience is that every time I’ve had “unprotected” sex, my wife did not get pregnant (otherwise we would have A LOT more than 3 kids!) But she did know, within a very short time (6 weeks or so) that she had a “bun in the oven”.

    Maybe a little lotion would take the sting out of yet another petey-godbot smack down! Come on back when you want some more!

  321. NYPete says:

    So in one paragraph you say that ending a pregnancy at any time “after the baby is conceived” is murder. That is usually within the first week or few days after sex that results in a pregnancy. Then in the very next paragraph you seem to say that abortion is murder if it takes place six weeks or so after sex that results in a pregnancy.
    Simply remarkable.
    But no matter where you place it, you think that abortion is murder. Yet you are not willing to charge the murderer — that is, the woman — with murder. In fact, you won’t charge her with criminal or civil offense. How can that possibly make sense?

  322. Athos says:

    BTW, here’s some reading that should really help you with life….(feel free to ask me any question on your reading assignment, petey-godbot) and stop pretending you anything about children

    https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org

  323. NYPete says:

    I don’t believe in the Christian God, so that link does not do anything for me. And it certainly does not answer the questions about abortion that you doggedly refuse to answer.

  324. Athos says:

    Too late, loser! Roe v Wade is NO MORE! And there is no help for you if you can’t read plain English and comprehend my answer.

    Maybe you should try belief in the Christian God. It would certainly help you understand the obvious answers provided for you. (Although if you really don’t want to know, you will never understand any language about how sacred life is)

  325. NYPete says:

    So now you have a chance to re-write Nevada law to make abortion a form of murder, as you believe it is. What shall the law say? Should it say that any action that intentionally results in the termination of a blastocyte or embryo or fetus is a criminal act? Should it say that taking mifepristone and misoprostol is an act of murder? Shall it outlaw IVF procedures which involve the disposal of unused embryos?
    You now have the power to make your words a reality — what are you going to do with it?

  326. Athos says:

    petey, stop lying. It damages your soul and destroys all of your credibility. Do you even know what the law is, in Nevada? Of course not. It’s more destructive for you to lie. For shame!

    Tom, I don’t know if you’re still following this, but imagine my shock when the RJ Headline this morning was a blatant error – “High court’s 5-4 ruling likely …..”

    At least the Sun got it right – “Justices, in 6-3 ruling….”

    Proof even our little corner of the world is corrupted.

  327. NYPete says:

    What was the lie? I asked simple questions — questions which you are very uncomfortable answering. Now that Nevada can enact any law it wishes regarding abortion, specifically what do you want that law to say? Do you want it to provide that any action that intentionally results in the termination of a blastocyte or embryo or fetus is a criminal act? Do you want it to say that taking mifepristone and misoprostol is an act of murder? Do you want the law to outlaw IVF procedures which involve the disposal of unused embryos?

    Now is your time to turn your words into concrete actions — what do you want to do?

  328. Sorry, Athos, that’s what I thought at first, but the R-J got it right. This was lower in the story: “The vote was 6-3 to uphold Mississippi’s law banning most abortions after 15 weeks, but Chief Justice John Roberts didn’t join his conservative colleagues in overturning Roe.

    “He wrote that there was no need to overturn the broad precedents to rule in Mississippi’s favor.” So, Roberts voted to uphold the law in question but not to overturn the entire Roe ruling.

  329. NYPete says:

    Good point, but it was ultimately still 5-4 in favor of overturning Roe (and Casey.)

  330. Athos says:

    “Now is your time to turn your words into concrete actions — what do you want to do?” petey, what is your problem? You don’t know Nevada law, do you? Didn’t your handlers give you the salient talking points so you don’t look like a dundering idiot? Here, let me help you out…

    “Nevada is one of nine states with abortion rights. It ensures abortions can be performed within the first 24 weeks of pregnancy.” https://www.8newsnow.com/news/local-news/nevada-constitution-protects-abortion-rights-insulating-state-from-roe-v-wade-decision/

    What’s the law in YOUR state, petey? Do you know it? It would appear that unless there is a dedicated group willing to take on the monumental task of getting the STATE legislature to enact another law, to be followed by the people of Nevada voting in 2 consecutive elections, our law is settled and it doesn’t MATTER what Athos wants.

    And with Roe officially aborted, people can now discuss a woman’s right to privacy vs an unborn child’s right to life. I would say it would be pretty hard to dismiss a heartbeat in the womb as anything other than a human life that is afforded the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. As to your drugs and other contraceptives, that would be for the people to decide, wouldn’t it?

    And I would MUCH rather have that discussion at the ballot box, where if I lose, I can come back in the next election and try to persuade a majority to vote with me, than live over the fiat of 7 out of 9 unelected lawyers (which are “hardly a cross section of America”) right?

    Beats the hell out of being ruled by fiat. Justice Scalia (RIP) had some great quotes that get to the merit of this whole shebang. “Win or lose, advocates for both sides continued pressing their cases, secure in the knowledge that an electoral loss can be negated by a later electoral win’

    “A system of government that makes the People subordinate to a committee of nine unelected lawyers does not deserve to be called a democracy.”

    There are 4 other great points (taken from https://www.christianpost.com/news/6-best-quotes-from-scalias-gay-marriage-dissent.html?page=2 ) and worth the short read. But my point is this, RoevWade should have ALWAYS been decided at the ballot box. Instead, 50 states were subjected tof a law that was decided by a majority of 9 men, over 49 years, and 62 million dead babies ago. And it took this long for the court to negate that bad law (much like “Brown” needed 58 years to overturn “Plessy”)

    Rant is over for now. I’m too happy that BABIES WON!!! gives me hope for sanity and reality!

  331. Athos says:

    Tom, so the Sun was wrong once again? (tsk-tsk-tsk)?

  332. NYPete says:

    Oh, Ok. So you are fine with abortion being legal in Nevada. Thanks for clearing that up.

  333. Yes, the Sun headline was wrong. The NYT story said the ruling to uphold the Mississippi law was 6-3, which is correct, but the story later noted: “Chief Justice John Roberts voted with the majority but said he would have taken ‘a more measured course,’ stopping short of overruling Roe outright.”

  334. Athos says:

    “Oh, Ok. So you are fine with abortion being legal in Nevada. Thanks for clearing that up.” petey, you’ve GOT to stop lying. It’s demeaning. You KNOW that I never said that, and yet, post ANOTHER lie, once again. I will ALWAYS call you on your lies, you dimwitted fabricator, you! Tell me how you feel that a woman’s right to privacy trumps a baby’s right to life. Make your argument, instead of acting like a 4 year old and reducing yourself to lies and deception.

    Tom, judging by the RJ headline, I think I detect a distinct bias. It’s a shame really, because we read the paper to get the news. Did Gannett ever own the RJ? Do they have some influence now that Sheldon in gone?

  335. NYPete says:

    You expressly said that Nevada law is settled in a pro-choice position and that it isn’t going to change. You didn’t say that you wanted to make a single change in the law. If you do, now is the time for you and your fellow conservatives to tell us exactly what you want to do. Do you and to make any act that intentionally terminates pregnancy after the moment of conception a criminal offense? If so, will it be treated just like murder? If not, why not?

    Or, perhaps you are like Adam Laxalt, whose position is “Dobbs is a great, great decision, but hey, don’t worry, I’m not actually suggesting that we change Nevada’s pro-choice law.”

  336. No Gannett ownership. None now. What headline bias?

  337. Athos says:

    “If you do, now is the time for you and your fellow conservatives to tell us exactly what you want to do…” So, are you telling me that you and your murderous lot NOW want to have a dialogue? What makes you think that I would want to discuss strategy with a lying godbot like you, petey? Do you think I’m part of the Stupid party that you’ve had so much success fooling?

    Here’s a question for you, that you have fastidiously ignored: is abortion murder?

  338. Athos says:

    What headline bias? I detect a left-leaning slant to the RJ. Today’s headline read “Justices ‘jolt’ system” The verb ‘jolt’ denotes violence or possibly a negative or bad thing (as if a return to constitutionally ruling on the law – which is a turn from where we’ve been – is a bad thing)

    Is there a better verb they could have used to be more neutral? Something that wouldn’t put off the 41% of their potential viewership (at least according to a “CBS Poll)? Even a focus on the “Return to Liberty” would be a welcome change. After 2+years of Covid lockdowns and mandatory vaccines, and the shuttering of schools and churches, shouldn’t the people want to have their liberties back?

    I am happy that they still retain an excellent cartoonist for the Opinion page. And maybe I’m still upset over their 5-4 headline from Saturday. And I do miss Vin’s column. (I know, nothing lasts forever…)

    What would be wrong with that headline to read “BABIES WIN”??

  339. Athos says:

    petey, on second thought, I will tell you what I think the law should be. The reason I ask you to establish what the term “abortion” means is that we both know it is murder (or ending the life of an unborn, if murder is too strong a word) and we need a starting point to talk about what comes next.

    If there is a heartbeat detected, then that unborn child should be allowed to be born. That is my position, petey. The heartbeat determines the human, and the human should be allowed full protection under the law. The actual procedure of abortion has been shielded from the public, and I believe that if it were presented as it really is, there would be a much higher % of Americans that support the Supreme Court decision of overturning Roe. And the funny thing is that women that have babies, know intrinsically that abortion is wrong.

    Are you good with that outcome?

  340. Jolt simply means to shake up, and they did.

  341. I miss Vin’s columns, too.

  342. Athos says:

    I still like “BABIES WIN!!”

  343. NYPete says:

    Now we are making progress. You do not think that protectible human life begins at the moment of conception, and you would permit procedures to terminate pregnancies up through the time when what you (erroneously) call a fetal “heartbeat” is detected. Anything after that is murder. With that position you disagree with the laws of several red states and with the Catholic Church. Well, I happen to strongly disagree with you, but at least you have now stated a clear position and set out your lines, and for that you should be commended.

  344. Athos says:

    Well now, I’m being commended by a bot! How special is this day?!? I’m a little confused as to what error I made about detecting a heartbeat of the child in the womb. Maybe you could elaborate?

    Now, if you wish to dialogue further, (which is what civil people do) you may want to expound on why abortion is not taking the life of an innocent. And for the record, I’m not a Roman Catholic (thus the rhythm method was not my birth control choice) and given how science has progresses to show us exactly how the child is formed in the womb, I stand by my position of “don’t kill the unborn”.

  345. NYPete says:

    Because I do not think that protectible human life begins until sometime around quickening, and because the so-called “heatbeat” standard is factually incorrect and philosophically/morally wrong. The Catholic approach of banning intentional termination of paregnancies from conception onwards is far more morally defensible, although most right-to-life Catholics become hypocrites when it comes to applying the proper standard of punishment for this “murder” to the person responsible – that is, the woman.

  346. Athos says:

    You absolutely leave me in your argument comparing the barbarous act of abortion with any form of birth control. And your argument of “protectible human life begins until sometime around quickening,” is vague at best and a dodge, or misdirection (because of its unknowable nature).

    Why do you believe the heartbeat standard is factually incorrect? I’ve witnessed 3 ultrasounds where there was a fetus and a heartbeat. I’ve even heard the heartbeat. And once that happens, there is no denying what that is.

    As to a murder charge, given our new brand of Soros backed DAs, your fears are overblown.

  347. NYPete says:

    1. If you believe, as the Catholic Church does and as many current red state laws specify, that protectable human life begins at conception, then several commonly-used forms of birth control, including IUDs and Plan B pills, are instruments of murder. So too, clearly, is IVF,
    2. Yeah, I have seen fetal heartbeats on ultrasound, around the start of the second trimester. Pretty cool. But that has nothing to do with the bogus “heartbeat” bills, which bans termination of pregnancy after about six weeks. That is generally the time when a woman learns she is pregnant. More importantly, THERE IS NO HEARTBEAT AT SIX WEEKS BECAUSE THERE IS NO HEART. There are no valves, there are no chambers, there is no vascular system, there is no blood flow, there is no heart. At six weeks, what will eventually become the fetal heart is a collection of cells which have begun to register electrical activity. At six weeks, what one might hear on an ultrasound is NOT a heartbeat. It is not any sound at all. What you hear is the ultrasound machine’s translation of the electrical impulses into sound.
    So the entire heartbeat meme is bogus — it is the creation of political consultants looking for an emotional hook, not of scientists, theologians or ethicists.
    3. Why should the putative emergence of one particular organ be the point at which protectible human life begins? Why the heart — why not the kidneys or the speen? Why not the completion of the brainstem? Is it because of Valentine’s Day? Surely people aren’t that stupid! What possible reason is there for drawing the moral and legal line at the (alleged) emergence of one element of the cardiovascular system??
    4. As I have said, at least the Catholic Church is consistent. If you are going to ban abortion, it has to be from the moment of conception. And no exceptions for sexual assault, incest, ectopic pregnancy, fetal malformation, etc. Anything else is hypocrisy or moral idiocy.

  348. Athos says:

    Once again, to compare the barbarous medical procedure of abortion to an IUD or a rubber is a false argument. Let me state this, then, and I thank you for clarifying my thinking. The medical practice of abortion should be banned. period. It is the taking of an innocent life. And I have yet to hear your arguments to the contrary.

    Plus

    You may want to check your facts because what I researched has the babies hearts beating after the 5th week. There is a heart in the 6th week, because it forms by the 5th.

  349. Athos says:

    petey, are you Roman Catholic? Or do you wish to be ruled by Roman Catholic principles? Or does your charge of “hypocrisy or moral idiocy” only apply one way? Actually, those terms could easily be applied to almost all politicians! (and certainly to the present crop, don’t you think?)

  350. NYPete says:

    No I am not Catholic and I certainly do not subscribe to the Catholic position on abortion. But at least it has a logic and an inner consistency. Unlike the so-called “heatbeat” standard, it isn’t the product of a bunch of focus group sessions with suburban swing voters.

  351. Athos says:

    petey, you really need to stop lying on this blog. It’s as if you really believe your own fairy tales! And of course your can’t do focus group sessions because your leftist incompetents are getting crushed! (fill up your gas tank lately? American voters are!) What percentage of the American public think Brandon is taking the country in the wrong direction?

    And as for hypocrisy, how about Pelousy and her DUI hubby taking communion AT THE VATICAN? Yep, those catholics “shore nuff” got it together when it comes to the reproductive argument, don’t they??

  352. NYPete says:

    I don’t believe either you or I are in a position to comment on Catholic religious practices.

    However, you are in a position to tell us precisely why the beginning of the “right to life” should be placed at the start of the emergence of the embryonic cardiovascular system and not at the development of the liver.

  353. Athos says:

    What a good point, petey. And one I’ll be happy to comment on as soon as you tell us all why you want to kill babies in the womb? Or if that’s too hard for you to do, maybe you could tell us when that little baby in the womb is afforded its 14th amendment rights?

    I’ll just sit over here and wait patiently for your answer. Otherwise, you COULD spend a little time apologizing for all your lies. Just list them out and fess up.

  354. NYPete says:

    I am in favor of the right to have an abortion at least through quickening and in very limited cases afterwards because government-mandate birthing is a monstrous idea that will have horrible consequences. But I also believe that people like you are moral hypocrites who draw illogical, arbitrary lines (such as the idea that the beginning of development of one particular embryonic organ is where abortion should be criminalized,) but are unable to face the consequences of their beliefs.

    Now that I have answered your question, you can tell us why abortion should be banned at the time the embryo begins to develop the cardiovascular system, and not when it begins to develop the gall bladder.

  355. Athos says:

    NO. You don’t get to lecture me on hypocrisy nor attribute beliefs to me that I have not stated. That is a form of lying and you are pretty good at it, I’ll give you that, petey godbot! Let’s cut to the real argument, shall we? I believe the Justices were quite clear that nowhere in our Constitution is the right to take the life of a child, which is EXACTLY what the medical procedure of abortion is.

    Are you capable of recognizing that truth, petey?

    What the Dobbs case has done, is to free America from the RIGHT to an unspeakable evil, that is, taking the life of an unborn child. Evil will always be with us. Slavery was evil. But Dredd Scott made is a RIGHT to deny the humanity of our fellow man, and had to be overturned with our 13th amendment (and a Civil War)

    I have always been against the medical act of abortion. It’s not a birth control pill or a an IUD, but a physical medical act with the soul purpose of ending the life of an innocent babe. How can you not see that for the evil that it is? You are arguing basic biology (and not too well, are you? how many weeks till there is a detectable heartbeat, petey? Is that before or after the “quickening”?) and I am standing on good vs evil.

    We’ve finally got our Constitutionalist majority on the Supremes. You leftist will have to sell your insane ideas to the public to get them enacted. I would call last week a very good start to Making America Great Again.

    It sure beats Brandon’s “America Last” credo!

  356. NYPete says:

    An IUD kills the poor little baby by blocking it from attaching itself to the uterine wall. IVF deliberately kills little babies by throwing unwanted embryos in the trash rather than implanting them in the mother. You are OK with both procedures, which means that you are an accessory to murder.

  357. Athos says:

    petey, give up. You’ve been hopelessly owned by my arguments for days now. All you can do is lie, get caught in the lie, ignore same, and lie some more (I never said I was “OK with both procedures” did I? )

    I just got done with anny, and the truth is, Donald Trump broke you folks beyond repair. And all Trump had to do, was stick to reality and your fantasy world crumbled (which would have happened eventually, but he used a crowbar instead of a scalpel.)

    Face it, petey. Your side wants to kill babies in the womb. My side wants to protect that innocent life. Your side encourages that barbarous act of tearing a baby apart, limb from limb and selling those parts for profit. My side wants to care for the difficult pregnancies and your side wants to burn our pregnancy centers to the ground.

    Try and stop and look at yourself. Hitler thought he was doing what was right as did Stalin and Mao (while they killed 10s of millions in pure acts of evil). They were either truly evil, or blinded by power, and couldn’t see themselves for what they were.

    Don’t be like them!

  358. NYPete says:

    You want to permit procedures, such as IVF, IUDs, Plan B pills and other procedures which kill little babies, simply because they have not yet developed the beginnings of a fetal heartbeat. How monsterous of you. How heartless.

  359. Athos says:

    Rage on, loser! All I’ve done is mop the floor with your sorry butt, and all you can do is project your evil on me!

    Get over it. The godbot is a failed program!

    I’m done talking to a bot. I thought if there was some spark of humanity, you could possibly be saved. No prayers for a clever bot.

  360. NYPete says:

    Think of all those little babies destroyed, their cells eliminated one by one, all because you are willing to permit IVF doctors to murder unwanted embryos.

  361. Athos says:

    Projecting again, petey-bot. Last I checked, it was your side that wants to abort babies.

    Serious question. Do bots ever get tired of losing an argument? Do bots feel shame? Do you ever wonder what would happen if you returned to the logical, real world?

    PSST. (Take the RED pill!)

  362. NYPete says:

    You have got to tell us why you want to murder those helpless little embryos, all alone in their IVF petri dishes.

  363. Athos says:

    Projecting AGAIN, petey? You’re just a one trick pony-bot, aren’t you?

    So go ahead. Answer your question!

  364. NYPete says:

    I can’t see how someone who professes to love six-week old fetuses could tolerate the murder of fetuses that are just a few weeks younger.

  365. Athos says:

    So tell me, why do you want to kill babies, petey? Should we be “red flagging” you?

  366. Athos says:

    Oh, here’s one for you. Seems RBG had an interesting quote that may shed some light on why you’re the champion of baby killing….

    “But there’s also Ginsburg herself, who had some pretty questionable views about abortion and race. Here’s an actual quote from the New York Times magazine, dating from 2009:

    Yes, the ruling about that surprised me. [Harris v. McRae — in 1980 the court upheld the Hyde Amendment, which forbids the use of Medicaid for abortions.] Frankly I had thought that at the time Roe was decided, there was concern about population growth and particularly growth in populations that we don’t want to have too many of. So that Roe was going to be then set up for Medicaid funding for abortion.” https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2020/09/ruth_bader_ginsburg_eugenicist.html

    Margaret Sanger would be proud (didn’t she start Planned Parenthood?) Could it possibly be that 79% of Planned Parenthood clinics are located in minority neighborhoods? What’s up with that, petey?

  367. NYPete says:

    Unlike you, I do not believe the fetus should have legally protectible rights, at least until quickening. So I support abortion and do not consider it murder. You, however, do believe that the fetus is a full human being with all legally protectible rights, and that abortion is murder. Therefore, you are a moral hypocrite as well as being incapable of sustained reasoning, in that you are willing to countenance the destruction of babies in their early embryonic stage of development.

  368. Athos says:

    petey the eugenicist! It all makes sense now! Can’t tell us when the “quickening” is but gotta keep killing them babies in the particular growth group (THAT’S why 79% PP clinics are in walking distance of minority neighborhoods – petey wants them thinned out!)

    Talk about hypocrisy! Late term abortions are “safe, legal and rare”, right?

  369. NYPete says:

    1. As I have said before, quickening is generally around 16-20 weeks — pretty much the Roe standard.
    2. Yes, late term abortions, tragic and necessary as they may be, are rare.
    3. I am not an “eugenicist,” (whatever that means,) but I do know that you refuse to state why you are willing to permit little babies to be murdered through IUDs or IVF.

  370. Athos says:

    ” but I do know that you refuse to state why you are willing to permit little babies to be murdered through IUDs or IVF.” So very wrong AGAIN petey-bot. What I refuse to do is let you hijack the argument! The Dobbs case doesn’t DEAL in IUDs or IVF, does it? It deals with the medical procedure known as abortion.

    And abortion isn’t mentioned in the Constitution, is it? That’s why so many legal minds stated “that, behind its own verbal smokescreen, the substantive judgment on which it rests is nowhere to be found.” (Laurence Tribe) You leftist computer bots scream about “Democracy” but you’ve hid behind the dictates of the majority of Supremes for decades, now. Sooo, the good guys played the game, finally got the Constitutionalist appointed to the Court (Donald Trump’s true legacy) and the proper decision IN LAW was meted out. Now you have to promote your ideas to the public and get your policies put in place democratically. Imagine that, botboy!

    And you can’t stand it! How ironic for the Democrats to be calling for insurrection as the January 6 show trial tries to gain traction.

    Boom! What’s that sound? peteybot being slammed to the mat, one more time!

  371. NYPete says:

    We aren’t talking about the Dobbs decision. We are talking about the fact that you claim that abortion is murder yet you are perfectly willing to permit the murder of babies prior to the sixth week of pregnancy, and that you won’t disavow the murder of babies via IUDs or IVF procedures.

  372. Athos says:

    Bot man, what part of “I refuse to let you frame the argument” don’t you understand? What I personally feel is no business of yours, and the very fact that you credit me with statements that I don’t make (“disavow the murder of babies via IUDs or IVF procedures”)?? You want to point out where I said that??What does that have to do with anything pertinent?
    I’m tired of arguing with a program that can’t see it’s broken and beaten by reality. You’re very much like patrick in that your only logical presentation is to not allow the other side to speak.

    Screw you, peteybot. I’m finished with you. Present your argument about why Dobbs isn’t the correct Supreme Court Decision, or go pull the wings off of flies.

  373. NYPete says:

    After refusing for literally months to provide a direct answer, you finally took a stand and said that the point in a woman’s pregnancy at which you would criminalize abortion was at the time of so-called “fetal heartbeat.” That is an absurd, illogical, unscientific and ethically immoral dividing line, and you have made no effort to defend it. It means that you would permit the destruction of embryos — “babies,” to you — any time before that. Using your own language, that means continuing to permit people to murder babies through standard IFV procedures, through the workings of IUDs, through morning after pills, etc. As I keep saying, at least the Catholics are morally consistent. They draw the line at conception. You, on the other hand, don’t have a moral leg – embryonic or otherwise – to stand on.

  374. Athos says:

    And why is a bot judging anyone on morality? Who do you think you are, petey? Do you think you’re God? Let me clue you in, you’re not. And as to your examples of purity, the Catholics are hardly the shining example of moral consistency (Pope/ communion/ Nancy Peolousy ring a bell?), are they?

    It must really trigger your shame button that I’m against the barbarous act of abortion because I RECOGNIZE THE PERSONHOOD IN THE WOMB, doesn’t it? That is a person. Abortion takes the life of that person. Abortion is evil.

    How do you morally justify this barbarous act, petey-bot??

    BOOM!

    petey-bot destroyed again!

    Face reality, loser. You don’t have an argument you can win, morally or otherwise! Other than lying about what I believe.

  375. NYPete says:

    No, you do not recognize personhood in the womb. Or, more precisely, you choose to only recognize personhood in the womb after an absurd, arbitrarily chosen point, such as the detection of electrical impulses in the cardiovascular area. Little human life before that point means nothing to you. You have no compunction about throwing all those little embryos away.

  376. Athos says:

    Once again, who are you to speak (falsely) for me? Or, more precisely, why do you speak nonsense instead of reasoned argument? Words have meanings, bot. You’re telling me that if a woman is pregnant, and goes to the abortion clinic, they place an IUD in her, and send her home. Or, they remove her eggs, and fertilize them outside of the womb, and place them back in the womb (IVF, which REALLY doesn’t explain what you’re talking about)

    Neither scenarios are remotely close to being abortifacient, but you keep using them to make some point completely different than the essence of the Dobbs case (and the barbarism of abortion). You might as well include Trojans, or the rhythm method or masterbation as part of your “throwing all those little embryos away”.. nonsensical babbling.

    On the other hand, I have nothing but respect for baby in the womb. Because I recognize that baby as an innocent and distinct human being.

    How do YOU see that human being, petey?

  377. NYPete says:

    IUD works by blocking the embryo — i.e., post-conception human life from implanting in the uterus. I.e., by your lights it kills the little baby.

    IVF creates multiple embryos — 4, 5, 6, perhaps more — in a petri dish. The doctor then implants one, perhaps two or three, and then (by your lights) murders the rest so that the mother does not have the dangers of triplets or quadruplets or more.
    Why are you willing to sacrifice so many little babies? Is it all a cold political calculation on your part?

  378. Athos says:

    petey-bot, how about instead of YOU inventing lies about what my “lights” are, which you clearly have no clue (because you can’t properly comprehend what I actually DO say), why don’t you tell me how YOU see that human being in the womb?

    It’s obvious that you are so unhinged by this Dobbs decision that you can’t tell the difference between birth control and abortion. Dobbs sent the abortion question back to the individual states to decide whether or not taking the life of an innocent babe is to be legal.

    There was no mention of birth control in Roe, or in Dobbs.

    Stop the bleeding, petey. Accept reality.

  379. NYPete says:

    IVF is not birth control. Most IVF procedures involve the deliberate destruction of multiple embryos. You are OK with that.
    Similarly, IUDs kill embryos by blocking them from implanting in the uterus. That is why Hobby Lobby sued the Obama Administration and won in the Supreme Court. Yet you are OK with IUDs.

  380. Athos says:

    You refuse to understand what I’m saying, with no logic or basis of fact. IUD is birth control. IVF is to produce a baby. Are you equating birth control with abortion? That seems illogical to me. Are you even aware, or just don’t care, what the procedure of abortion does to a babe in the womb?

    Listen, petey, I know your side represents the desire to remove the sex organs of our children, and rip the limbs off babes in the womb, and sell those body parts in order to afford a fancy car, but you really need to come back into real world, because we’re just not gonna let that happen. This is America! Not some barbarous, backwater hole that you socialists want us all to inhabit. Your side’s policies never work. And people suffer.

    And apologies for having to use such a big word that you’re oblivious to the meaning (abortifacient). How about just looking it up next time and prevent the embarrassment of ignorance? The Supreme Court Case decision is “Dobbs v. Jackson Women’s Health Organization” IUDs and IVF aren’t mentioned, are they?

    So tell us all what your fixation on “the deliberate destruction of multiple embryos” is REALLY all about, will ya? Get it off your chest, petey! It’s good for your everlasting soul.

  381. NYPete says:

    When IUDs result in the intended destruction of fertilized eggs, they cause abortion. When IVF results in the intended destruction of little embryos, it is abortion. You are in favor of such practices continuing, so you are a pro-abortionist, Athos, a stone-cold pro-abortionist. You want women to be permitted to destroy the little, little embryos and fertilized eggs, to take away their lives before they ever see blue skies outside of the womb, to crush them before their little embryonic buds ever develop into full-fledged organs, just to satisfy some feeling of convenience, or to permit their abortionist “doctor” to purchase a four-door Cadillac. You are truly a moral monster.

  382. Athos says:

    petey, whether you’re a bot or a real person, you missed your calling…….fictional drama writer! It takes a special talent to go that far out in limbo-villa just to fail at proving a point!

    Here’s one I’d like to see you wrap your fingers around….I believe in the right to privacy, but how does that eliminate the right to life of an unborn baby?

    Rather than pure fictional hyperbole, (“…You want women to be permitted to destroy the little, little embryos and fertilized eggs, to take away their lives before they ever see blue skies outside of the womb, to crush them before their little embryonic buds ever develop into full-fledged organs,…”), how about take a crack at right to privacy vs right to life?

  383. NYPete says:

    It is not fictional hyperbole. Several states have taken the morally consistent position of defining life as beginning at the moment of conception. You are the one who refuses to accept the real-world consequences of your advocacy of government-mandated birthing.
    As for “privacy” v. “life,” what you really mean is “liberty ” v. “life”. You want to take away the liberty of a 15 year-old girl by forcing her to carry a fetus for nine months, regardless of the consequences to her mental and physical health and life prospects. I want to respect her liberty.

  384. Athos says:

    Oh, petey. You’re lucky your mother doesn’t wash out your mouth with soap for telling all these lies! The ONLY place that says IUDs and IVFs are abortion, is in your twisted little imagination! You writing a book or something?

    Once again, in the USA, it is evil to give one person the RIGHT to eliminate the life of an innocent babe. Does evil happen in this world? Yes! Look how long this country went denying the Negro his humanity! We corrected that one, and God willing, we can correct the Roe travesty. You can’t respect the liberty of a 15 year old by denying the liberty of her baby. Please tell me you get that??

  385. NYPete says:

    Boy, you really need to talk to the fold at Hobby Lobby. They argued to the Supreme Court that their insurance policy shouldn’t have to cover IUDs because they act as an abortifacant — and they won! And you should read up about how multiple embroys — little babies, to you — are routinely destroyed as standard operation procedure in IVF clinics across the nation.

    Since still say you are in favor of government-mandated birthing for 15 year olds, I still can’t see how you can square your positions.

  386. Athos says:

    Of course you can’t see how I “square” my position, petey. You live in a fantasy world! Congrats on you Hobby Lobby win! Now you stay gainfully employed and a productive member of society!

    If you don’t want to acknowledge the personhood of the babes in the womb that are murdered by abortion, I understand. You’ve been brainwashed by immoral shame filled cretins that want infanticide. Just remember, (and try to let it sink in) that your right to privacy doesn’t supersede another innocent human being’s right to life.

    or

    Just as no one has the right to kill you, petey, just because you may inconvenience them, or cost them money, or ruin their chance of promotion; you don’t have the right to take away the liberty of the unborn. You don’t want to be murdered, right? It is logical that you must give the same consideration to someone that is unable to voice the same.

    In fact, when someone kills a pregnant mother, they are usually charged with 2 murders, aren’t they?

    Get it??

  387. NYPete says:

    My position is completely consistent: I generally believe in the Roe v. Wade standards.
    Your position … is a moral monstrosity. You think procedures which terminate pregnancy after electrical impulses are detected in what will eventually be the cardiovascular system are murder. But you are OK with procedures which terminate the pregnancy before that.
    And, either way, you obviously don’t believe that abortion is murder, because you do not actually wish to charge the woman who gets the abortion (or who uses abortion medication) with any criminal or civil liability.
    You are a moral monster.

  388. Athos says:

    And the fertile imagination of petey strikes again! So…..if I’m a “moral monster” to someone that agrees with abortion up to the moment of birth, we must truly live in a “Bizarro World”! Fortunately, you don’t get to make that judgement call, petey. You’ve slipped the tethers of reality.

    And I would never go after the woman that has an abortion. Planned parenthood and the doctors that perform this barbarous procedure (whatever DID happen to Dr. Kermit Gosnell, anyway?) are fair game for some serious charges.

    And just so I’m not being obscure, petey. there is NO UNIVERSE where IUDs and IVFs are considered abortion. Which means it CERTAINLY isn’t mentioned in “Dobbs”, is it? I’m shocked you don’t include masturbation. Think of all those potential babies going down the shower drain!

    Grow up. You’ve been owned AGAIN. You are “completely consistent” in arguing fantasy from your hack handlers, and losing any logical debate. (I guess you’ll just have to use logic and reality, petey)

  389. NYPete says:

    1. Tell us how, if protectible life begins at the moment of conception, and IVF results in the destruction of human embryos, IVF is not murder.
    2. While you are at it, tell us how a grown woman who demands to have an abortion the moment of birth, is not a murderer, but the nurse and doctor who follows her directives are murderers.

  390. Athos says:

    1) Tell me where you’re getting your information labeling IVF as abortion (other than in your fertile imagination)
    2) You’ve shown, once again, your inability to comprehend the written word. Read again my stance on “never go after the woman that has an abortion..” and contemplate the difference with accusing that woman of murder.
    3) if number 2 is too difficult for you, give me a brief synopsis of “The Trial of Kermit Gosnell: The Shocking Details And What It Revealed About The Abortion Industry In America” by Cheryl Sullenger ….that should clear up the subject for you

  391. Porthos says:

    We’ve now hit 400 replies, Tom! Is it bonus time??

  392. NYPete says:

    1. You can learn how IVF involves the deliberate destruction of human embroyos through the simplest of Google searches. Do you need help in understanding how Google works?
    2. It is true that you have not advocated the criminal prosecution of women who actively seek abortion. That makes you a moral hypocrite, for you believe abortion is murder. Someone who commits or solicits a murder is a murderer. After all, it is the woman who seeks and pays off the hit man (the doctor or nurse) — right? So why are you willing to let someone who commits intentional, first-degree murder get off scot free?

  393. Athos says:

    1)Your continued failure to read and comprehend plain English never ceases to amaze me, petey! My request was for YOU to provide me your data source for labelling IVF as abortion.
    What’s the matter? Can’t find any? Maybe you should try Google search, eh?
    2) For a shameless, reality-void parrot like yourself to call anyone a moral hypocrite is truly a colossal case of chutzpah! You continue to outdo yourself in anal pomposity, petey!

    Well done, oh mighty bot! While you can show your masters what a loyal Renfield you are, you show the world you dwell on Planet Bizarro World (where Reality never goes!)

    The good news is you’ve gone so far over the edge that even Joe Sixpack is seeing how insane and blood thirsty you are (and they are all rejecting your credo).

    What’s Brandon’s approval ratings again?

  394. Athos says:

    Test

  395. Portos says:

    Ah shucks. No more petey!?! BOOM! Bot blow up!

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out /  Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out /  Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out /  Change )

Connecting to %s