If it smells like payback, it might be payback

It is called quid pro quo — something for something.

The Wall Street Journal reported this week that after Secretary of State Hillary Clinton negotiated a deal with a Swiss bank to let it out from under a sweeping U.S. subpoena for records of depositors who might be dodging IRS taxes the bank hired Bill Clinton to be a speaker and contributed to the Clintons’ foundation.

But the story contained some rather imprecise language.

“There is no evidence of any link between Mrs. Clinton’s involvement in the case and the bank’s donations to the Bill, Hillary and Chelsea Clinton Foundation, or its hiring of Mr. Clinton,” it says. That language was picked up in today’s Las Vegas newspaper story about Clinton’s finances and medical reords.

There is no “proof” of a link, but there is plenty of evidence.

Clinton’s department settled with Swiss bank UBS to turn over 4,450 accounts instead of 52,000 being sought by the IRS.

After that UBS increased Clinton Foundation donations from less than $60,000 through 2008 to $600,000 by the end of 2014. UBS

The bank also paid Bill Clinton $1.5 million to participate in a series of panel discussions.





58 comments on “If it smells like payback, it might be payback

  1. Steve says:

    Of course…paying the husband does nothing to help the wife.

    The real problem is not really the wealthy and their money, that is how this country began and grew. It was the wealthy who paid for most of it from the start and well into its history. The trouble is the power politicians now have over the donors and the quid pro quo that follows that power.

    Less power would lead to less corruption and the money would mean much less.

  2. Rincon says:

    Your theory breaks down when taken to its logical conclusion: Zero governmental power would not eliminate the power of today’s political donors. It would enhance them immensely, since only they would be able to support the security arrangements needed to survive in conditions of anarchy. That is to say, the power of government is not the only power one should fear.

  3. Steve says:

    reductio ad absurdum

  4. Rincon says:

    Reductio ad absurdum is considered a valid form of logic, so thank you for agreeing with me. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reductio_ad_absurdum

    My point though, was not that reducing governmental power couldn’t lead to less corruption, just that it cannot possibly be a hard and fast truth, i.e., in some situations, it is indeed absurd, thus your statement has no evidence to back it up, even though it could be correct.

  5. Rincon says:

    I have to agree that Hillary is indeed a scumbag, as is Bill. My question to myself though, is do I elect a scumbag who’s competent or a “principled” Republican like George W. was, who either has no brain or would pander to a half crazy party base? As usual, both alternatives are lousy.

  6. Steve says:

    There are no if’s and’s but’s or why-hows Rincon.
    You went to the absurd trying to make a point same as many on the right who say if taxes are so great for the country then we need to tax at 100%. Your extreme is showing, Rincon.

    My point about shrinking the federal government is to take it to the place the founders wrote for it in the constitution, NOT to ZERO for crying out loud.


  7. Rincon says:

    I don’t think we’ll ever agree on reductio ad absurdum, but you missed the best part: To quote myself, “…your statement has no evidence to back it up.”

  8. Steve says:

    No evidence?

    US history proves it. And current trends show the worsening.

  9. Rincon says:

    In many cases, government enlarges when some sort of nefarious activity takes place in the private sector or when the private sector is willfully negligent, so, yes, when there’s more money being spent, there’s more that can stick to greasy fingers. The problem is that you completely neglect the abuses that have occurred in the private sector throughout history. The nostalgia you have for smaller government misses out on things like the patent medicine industry, which killed thousands with the new miracle drug, radium alone. Many federal agencies were created when the public demanded relief from the abuses piled on them by private enterprise.

  10. How did Americans survive for nearly three hundred years without the Federal behemoth to take care of them? Dependency on government is a cancer…

  11. Steve says:

    Private sector bad, bad, bad…it makes the things we all like to have and it grows the things we all need to eat.

    Government consumes. Big government consumes more. Bigger government consumes even more.

    Private sector is well regulated today. More is not needed. Less is called for.

  12. Rincon says:

    I agree. The private sector is well regulated today and in some ways, overregulated. You advocate less government power, which necessitates less regulation of the private sector. Perhaps you meant to say the private sector is overregulated today? If accomplished with a scalpel rather than a chain saw, I would agree on reducing regulations.

  13. Steve says:

    That’s better.

    Now for more ACA stuff.

    I thought the website would figure the subsidy for both of us and apply it to whichever of us would be getting coverage, then split that same amount once I decided add myself into the mix and get a policy.

    I was wrong. Tonight I decided to get a CDHP plan for myself in addition to the Silver VIP plan I already got for my wife.
    What happens is they terminate my wife’s plan and I had to choose it all over again (I could have chosen another)
    The subsidy doubled when I opted in and they now had two people from the same household qualifying due to my downsize. (I thought I would have to wait because I was still employed when I set her insurance up, this is not the case.)
    Once I chose my CDHP Bronze and her VIP Silver the out of pocket premium went DOWN by about 70 dollars dollars. The total cost, what taxpayers are chipping in now that we both have selected plans, increased by more than $500 (The subsidy doubled once I added myself into the mix.) Both plans are effective as of 9/1/15 once I pay my portion of the premium. And I am using inheritance money so it’s all tax free for me.

    I just don’t see how this is actually lowering national debt, but for now, PARTY ON!

    (I am actively seeking employment, but I can be really picky about what I take this time.)

  14. nyp says:

    I am pleased that you and your family now have high-quality, affordable health insurance while you are looking for new employment. That should give you great peace of mind should anything happen while you are between jobs. I hope no one tries to take those insurance protections away from your family.

  15. Steve says:

    Party on, Garth!

  16. Rincon says:

    The intensity of the party has subsided. While the nation is subsidizing Steve’s medical care, total medical costs have risen much less under Obamacare than previously.

  17. nyp says:

    Funny that you seem to have no sense of gratitude towards the President who created the program that provides your family with much needed high quality, low cost health insurance.

  18. Steve says:

    Gratitude at being forced to buy something I do not personally need?

    crony capitalism at its best.

    You guys couldn’t even get what you claimed for your goal. All I’m doing is obeying the law.
    If you insist, I am happy for the loopholes I found!

    As for that “downward pressure in the medical cost curve” I refer you to the words made famous by James Carville.

  19. nyp says:

    1. You are saying that your family would be better off without health insurance???

    2. I am quite pleased that we have had 64 consecutive months of private-sector job growth.

  20. Steve says:

    “private-sector job growth” out of the sub basement into the basement!



    I SAID I am being forced to buy something I do not personally need, nyp. Being “better off” would be me being able to use my own money as I see fit.

  21. nyp says:

    So you would prefer that your family not have health insurance? What would you do if one of you were in a car accident? Came down with breast cancer?

  22. Steve says:

    At the risk of repeating myself:

    I SAID I am being forced to buy something I do not personally need, nyp. Being “better off” would be me being able to use my own money as I see fit.

  23. nyp says:

    Your family does not need and does not want affordable health insurance?? How can you say that?

  24. Steve says:


    I SAID I am being forced to buy something I do not personally need, nyp. Being “better off” would be me being able to use my own money as I see fit.

    And I see there was another shooting at a location filled with targets intentionally made defenseless. Lucky it wasn’t worse.

  25. nyp says:

    but, as I understand it, the insurance is for your wife. are you saying that she does not need affordable health insurance?

  26. Steve says:

    For the umpteenth time:

    I SAID I am being forced to buy something I do not personally need, nyp. Being “better off” would be me being able to use my own money as I see fit.

  27. nyp says:

    your wife does not need health insurance? how can you say that?

  28. Steve says:

    and yet again;

    I SAID I am being forced to buy something I do not personally need, nyp. Being “better off” would be me being able to use my own money as I see fit.

  29. nyp says:

    why do you say that you don’t need health insurance? Do you have separate private coverage?

    If there was no ACA, how would your wife obtain health insurance, and how much would it cost without subsidies?

  30. Steve says:

    you just won’t give up trying to invent non meanings for my statement.

    I clearly posted:

    I am being forced to buy something I do not personally need, nyp. Being “better off” would be me being able to use my own money as I see fit.

  31. nyp says:

    did you have health insurance prior to purchasing a private plan from the ACA exchange?

  32. Steve says:

    You know the answer to that.

  33. nyp says:

    I mean, it sounds to me like you did not have affordable private health insurance and now, thanks to the ACA, you do. And so does your wife.
    If I were you, I would feel grateful to the folks that made that possible.

  34. Steve says:

    Making assumptions again, you are.

    Got the COBRA offer today….what a crock of crap that law was.

  35. nyp says:

    so you are being offered COBRA insurance benefits — pretty expensive, and no subsidy. And after the COBRA expires, you would have had nothing, but for the protections of the ACA.

  36. Steve says:

    Again wrong, from all angles.

    ACA is law, to be obeyed. I would have spent my money as I would have seen fit.

  37. nyp says:

    you mean, you would not have purchase health insurance for you and your family? That would be highly irresponsible.

  38. Steve says:

    “you mean”

    You keep trying, I never said that.

  39. Gonna get a lot of mileage out of this one…

  40. Rincon says:

    !) Don’t bother asking Steve. He isn’t capable of clarification. To him, it’s your fault if you didn’t understand his utterance. 2) Somehow, although we have 535 politicians who make up 1/3 of the government and are demonstrably doing almost nothing, whatever isn’t perfect is the President’s fault. As long as you like that game, the economy sank for Obama’s first two quarters, but has then risen steadily albeit slowly. Under Bush, the economy tanked badly in the last year of his administration. By your rules, Obama looks like a genius compared to Bush.

    Now for the real (greatest) reason: Easy credit tempted the middle and lower classes to spend more on housing and other goodies than they spent 20 years before, despite their incomes being no greater, resulting in recession. The middle class still makes little more than they did 30 years ago and are still in debt. Why would anyone expect a robust recovery? We humans imagine that the government has a powerful short term influence on the economy and can fix it as needed. News flash: It can’t

  41. Steve says:

    I was abundantly clear, Rincon. I should be able to spend my own money any way I choose.

    Nyp kept trying to make up fantasy scenarios for what that “means”.

    Nyp seems upset that I do not appear to be grateful that some government body has direct control over how I choose to spend my money.

    There is nothing to explain.
    I am obeying the law but I do have to agree with it.

  42. Nyp says:

    So without the law you would have chosen to go w/o health insurance for you and your family?

  43. Steve says:

    You again try to say things for me.
    What I said is clear.

    You are trying to make up things for me so you can argue with them.

    You will be arguing with yourself.

    My money should be mine to spend as I see fit.

  44. Nyp says:

    Did you and your wife have health insurance?

  45. nyp says:

    By the way, now that you guys have been forced by the evil Democrats to have affordable, high-quality health insurance to protect yourselves against medical and financial ruin, how have things gone with the death panels? I mean, there must be death panels, right?

    And another thing — when you went for a check-up, was there a government bureaucrat there in the examination room, standing between you and your doctor? After all, we were told over and over and over that the ACA would mean pointy-headed bureaucrats would be standing between us and our physicians. Was the examination room big enough to hold the three of you?

  46. Steve says:

    You are not my “dad”.

  47. nyp says:

    But you guys are now yoked to ObamaCare. You are in the belly of the beast. How much of a nightmare is it to have health insurance? Did the government bureaucrat force you to go before the death panel?

    Inquiring minds want to know!

  48. Steve says:

    Gratitude must be earned.

    Stealing stuff doesn’t do it.

  49. nyp says:

    I fully understand that you do not feel any gratitude towards the President for getting you and your family the high quality, low cost health insurance you now enjoy.

    But I’m just wondering, now that you are an ObamaCare guinea pig, if you could detail for us the dystopian nightmare that you and your wife must be experiencing.

  50. Steve says:

    I can teel, from that response, you have not been reading what I have been posting.

  51. nyp says:

    You guys have ObamaCare, right? Just tell us all about it! Death panels, internet snafus, lurking bureaucrats — the works!

  52. Steve says:

    I have already detailed on internet snafu, go back and read all about it.

  53. nyp says:

    Wow – an internet snafu! Damn you, Obama!

  54. Steve says:


    Turns out, to another person into the group (no matter what insurance plan is being chosen) all existing coverage must be terminated.
    This is not only confusing but it also means all new cards must be generated, all new accounts must be created and this is an early indication of the ” lurking bureaucrats” your describe.

    All in just the first week!

  55. Nyp says:

    OMG – new cards must be issued!

  56. Steve says:

    Oh right…you ignore all the back office stuff as though it doesn’t exist.

    Meanwhile Nevada health Coop is losing money and looking for an average 15% increase in premiums next year.
    I believe we have nailed one of the reasons!

  57. Rincon says:

    And yet, medical costs are increasing far more slowly than when the good ol’ system was in place. The old way must have been even more wasteful!

  58. Steve says:

    And we have yet ANOTHER reason Nevada Health Coop is LOSING money and looking for a 15% premium INCREASE next year!

    Would you guys like to go for three?

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